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small dogs and bark collars

KessyWessy
February 16th, 2008, 01:51 PM
Hi,
I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with different types of bark collars. Here is whats going on.

Our two dogs Kes (yorkie/pom) and Riker (min pin) bark when they hear a noise, like somone approaching the house. However this is causing a huge problem for my husband in the days becaue we have a 9 month old daughter. What is it the bark the loudest and won't quiet when told when she's asleep.

We have tried training techniques to curb this wih little to moderate success, over time. We haven't actually had a trainer come in though.

He has had it with the barking and is bound an determined to buy a bark collar.

I understand that they are barking because they think they're guard dogs. My question is do bark collars work?

He wants to get shock collars for them, but the thought of it hurts my heart. Do they work- do they hurt as much as I imagine they would? And has anyone ever tried the citronella collars?

Like I said I don't want to do this, but he's put his foot down on this one. I'd hire a bahaviourist, but I don't think my husband will agree to that. Advice/experiences? Brands to try? :woof:


Thanks

rainbow
February 16th, 2008, 02:03 PM
Have you tried spraying them in the face with one of those water misters?

KessyWessy
February 16th, 2008, 02:17 PM
Have you tried spraying them in the face with one of those water misters?

Not for this, I did try it with Kes as a puppy for something.... It didn't work out for us because by the time we got close enough we had distracted her with our lumbering over. It would be even more problematic now, because my husband wuld have to spray 2 dogs at once, while he is home alone with a baby, and probably have to come either up or downstairs besides. I think all that commotion might get them barking even more.

Thanks for the suggestion though.

jessi76
February 17th, 2008, 08:42 PM
Our two dogs Kes (yorkie/pom) and Riker (min pin) bark when they hear a noise, like somone approaching the house. However this is causing a huge problem for my husband in the days becaue we have a 9 month old daughter. What is it the bark the loudest and won't quiet when told when she's asleep.

you need to teach the dogs QUIET. however, if you really can't manage to train them, then why not just put them in another part of the house while the baby sleeps? for goodness sake, they are 2 SMALL dogs - gate them into a family room and have your husband PLAY with them while the baby naps.

better yet, have your husband use a GOOD baby monitor, and take the dogs out in the yard for some exercise while the baby sleeps. your husband will hear the baby crying if it's a quality monitor. this would be a win-win situation... baby gets to sleep without being woken by barking dogs. Hubby gets time away from crying baby. dogs get quality time w/ hubby, and fresh air and exercise which will make them LESS LIKELY to bark at anything that moves.

I honestly don't think you are going to get any suggestions, recommendations, or advocates for bark or shock collars here. We are more a community of positive solutions and training.

, but he's put his foot down on this one.

oye vey... if that were my fiance.... well, let's just say he'd lose that foot.

BigRover
February 18th, 2008, 04:53 PM
Bark collars work great on some dogs but not all. My concearn with your dogs would be the fact that they're so small. If you choose to go the bark collar route, make sure the collars you purchase are made specifically for dogs your size. I think using them or not is a personal choice, however if you do choose to use them you should educate yourself to make sure you use them correctly.

Citronella collars work on dogs about 5% of the time. If you're not comfortable with the idea of a static collar, the citronella collar is an alternative. However keep in mind, if your dog isn't bothered by the smell of citronella, the collar won't work on him. Lots of people who try the citronellas end up with the static collars in the end. Since you plan to train both dogs you would have to seperate them while they wear the collars. Otherwise since this method of training is scent based, if one dog barks and gets sprayed the other dog will smell the spray and he may be confused compromising the training. Also keep in mind, the smell will be present in your home. While the smell of citronella is nice and clean, you might find it irritating especially if your dogs bark a lot.

Another issue for you to consider. If your dogs have a tendancy to be fearful or are of a softer nature, this might not be the training tool for them. Some dogs never put the correction and the bark together and only end up getting freaked out by the sensetion that to them comes from no where and for no reason. If you think your dog is reacting poorly to a collar after it's had some time to get used to it, take it off and return it.

Calling a behaviourist is still not a bad idea. They could work with you to ensure you use the collars correctly as well as give you any tips on what else you can try with the dogs before choosing that route. Considering you just had a baby, I think having a behaviourist come in is a great idea. They could also help you develop a baby and dogs strategy for the next few years to ensure you don't run into any baby vs the dogs problems.

BMDLuver
February 18th, 2008, 05:38 PM
I'm assuming that you gave birth to your daughter.. If so, then your daughter is used to the sound of a barking dog in utero.. so the dog barking while she sleeps shouldn't be waking her up now. Is it actually waking her up or is it just stressing your husband that it will wake her up?

It's inate behaviour for the pom mix in particuliar to bark, they do think they are guard dogs in tiny packages. I would think you would be better off with what is called a Bark Eliminator. It's a small device that is plugged in to the wall and emits a sonic sound when a vibration from barking occurs. This sound gets the dog on the first bark which in turn distracts and the barking stops. This way you are not physically punishing the dogs by zapping them and it reduces the amount of barking. We have one at our place for an incessant barking berner and it is working well with him. He barks if a leaf floats by, silly guy.

BusterBoo
February 18th, 2008, 06:53 PM
I am one of the owners who did use a bark collar, but it was the citronella one. At the time I had two dogs and the older one (Harley) didn't bark but the younger one (Buster) did. I bought the collar, used it about 4-6 times and Buster got the hint. The spray doesn't go in the face, it is under the chin. You MUST make sure it is fitted properly so as not to spray in the mouth or eyes.

It's been over a year since Buster has had the collar on and if he gets too noisy all I need to say is "I'll get your collar" and he stops. He is also listening now when I say No Bark.

My hubby also wanted the shock collar and I put my foot down on that one!

BigRover
February 22nd, 2008, 03:55 AM
I would think you would be better off with what is called a Bark Eliminator. It's a small device that is plugged in to the wall and emits a sonic sound when a vibration from barking occurs. This sound gets the dog on the first bark which in turn distracts and the barking stops. This way you are not physically punishing the dogs by zapping them and it reduces the amount of barking. We have one at our place for an incessant barking berner and it is working well with him. He barks if a leaf floats by, silly guy.

Have you ever used a bark eliminator? It's one of the biggest pet product scams for the emotionally guilty pet owners. In other words, they don't work other then to add more noise (and annoying noise as heck!) to the noise already created by the dog. Not to mention I would not expose an infant to such a device, not sure if they would be harmful to their hearing but they sure can't be good for their sleeping habbits.

KessyWessy
February 22nd, 2008, 02:22 PM
Thank you all so much for your replies.

Thanks to the fact we are absolutely strapped for time, especially in the evenings we have not had the opportunity to get a training collar!:thumbs up

In that time I have managed to get my husband to agree that a shock collar would likely do more harm than good. Riker is a nervous fearful dog by nature, training him at all has always been a challenge because if you're not forcefull enough he'll ignore you, but if you're even a little too harsh he totally freaks out and can't focus on being corrected. I don't think the poor guy'd recover from being shocked.

I also got my husband to agree that the citronella collar will probably be ineffective, but I told him we can still try it if he insists.

For now he is going to put the dogs out (its a small area- maybe 4 x 6 feet) for a few minutes when the baby is sleeping, and when they come in he'll put them in their crates.

I guess they think it's their duty to bark when they hear a noise, especially at the door, but I think they consider themselves on a break when they're crated, since they are less likely to bark while crated unless they hear something really unusual or loud.

The thing is I don't want them to never bark again - While she's not yappy, Kes is a vocal dog, its part of her personality to make little noises all the time. I'd be really sad if a shock collar stopped her from doing that.

I think DH was just angry and frustrated when he decided all that. I'm just thankful he wasn't in a position to rush out to the pet store right then!

Thank you all again for your input, there were some really good points and ideas there. I appreciate your help.

NoahGrey
February 22nd, 2008, 03:58 PM
if he gets too noisy all I need to say is "I'll get your collar" and he stops.

And that's a good thing. More like he has a fear issue with it. That's sad and frusating.

Not to offend anyone, but I personally think that bark collars are cruel. It's the lazy mans approach to training your dog. I believe training should be also a bonding, fun learning experience for both the owner and dog. It should go beyond just putting a bark collar on them.

ACO22

BMDLuver
February 22nd, 2008, 05:34 PM
Have you ever used a bark eliminator? It's one of the biggest pet product scams for the emotionally guilty pet owners. In other words, they don't work other then to add more noise (and annoying noise as heck!) to the noise already created by the dog. Not to mention I would not expose an infant to such a device, not sure if they would be harmful to their hearing but they sure can't be good for their sleeping habbits.

Did you at all read my post? I am using one right now and it's been extremely effective. If you researched them you would find that they are not audible by human ears just like a dog whistle. Really should try something before you bash the heck out of it.:wall:

sugarcatmom
February 22nd, 2008, 05:58 PM
Not sure if you've tried this in any of your training, but it's usually more effective to train a dog to stop barking if you first train it to bark on command. There's a good description here on how to do it: http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/excessive-barking-0

BigRover
February 22nd, 2008, 09:31 PM
Did you at all read my post? I am using one right now and it's been extremely effective. If you researched them you would find that they are not audible by human ears just like a dog whistle. Really should try something before you bash the heck out of it.:wall:


In that case we are not talking about the same product. I was thinking about the ones where the sound is audible to humans. I haven't met any one using one like what you're describing, if it works for you, great! Do you have a link you could share for it?

BigRover
February 22nd, 2008, 09:38 PM
And that's a good thing. More like he has a fear issue with it. That's sad and frusating.

Not to offend anyone, but I personally think that bark collars are cruel. It's the lazy mans approach to training your dog. I believe training should be also a bonding, fun learning experience for both the owner and dog. It should go beyond just putting a bark collar on them.

ACO22


I think the head halters are cruel and a lazy man's approach to dog training :) In all seriousness, I think each training tool has it's purpose and not all are good or appropriate for all dogs. There is no black or white. As a good trainer you need to be able to assess what works for the each individual dog and the person training the dog (the owner). Just like people, dogs have different personalities, different learning abilities, and different learning styles. What works for one, is a disaster for another, and vice versa.

BigRover
February 22nd, 2008, 09:48 PM
Good to hear that you found such a wonderful solution that makes both you and your husband happy! If Kes is such a vocal dog, I doubt you would be able to train it all out of her.

If they are not likely to bark when crated, then you are on to something! That is a very very good sign, really! It means they can be relatively easily persuaded that there is no need to bark when they are out of the crate.

How is their general obedience? How well do they listen to you when under mild and major distractions? I would suggest you come up with a few obedience routines to practice with them that you could use at times they do get barky. That would shift their focus back on to you. Something as simple as "shush, lie down, stay, good, come, sit, down, good!" to a bit more complicated "where's your ball? go get it" Dogs LOVE having jobs to do. Unfortunetly some times they come up with their own.

Thank you all so much for your replies.

Thanks to the fact we are absolutely strapped for time, especially in the evenings we have not had the opportunity to get a training collar!:thumbs up

In that time I have managed to get my husband to agree that a shock collar would likely do more harm than good. Riker is a nervous fearful dog by nature, training him at all has always been a challenge because if you're not forcefull enough he'll ignore you, but if you're even a little too harsh he totally freaks out and can't focus on being corrected. I don't think the poor guy'd recover from being shocked.

I also got my husband to agree that the citronella collar will probably be ineffective, but I told him we can still try it if he insists.

For now he is going to put the dogs out (its a small area- maybe 4 x 6 feet) for a few minutes when the baby is sleeping, and when they come in he'll put them in their crates.

I guess they think it's their duty to bark when they hear a noise, especially at the door, but I think they consider themselves on a break when they're crated, since they are less likely to bark while crated unless they hear something really unusual or loud.

The thing is I don't want them to never bark again - While she's not yappy, Kes is a vocal dog, its part of her personality to make little noises all the time. I'd be really sad if a shock collar stopped her from doing that.

I think DH was just angry and frustrated when he decided all that. I'm just thankful he wasn't in a position to rush out to the pet store right then!

Thank you all again for your input, there were some really good points and ideas there. I appreciate your help.

BusterBoo
February 22nd, 2008, 10:27 PM
And that's a good thing. More like he has a fear issue with it. That's sad and frusating.

Not to offend anyone, but I personally think that bark collars are cruel. It's the lazy mans approach to training your dog. I believe training should be also a bonding, fun learning experience for both the owner and dog. It should go beyond just putting a bark collar on them.

ACO22

No....there is no "fear issue" with Buster and his collar......he doesn't like the collar of course.....but does any dog like to be told No and corrected??? No pain was inflicted on Buster, he wasn't traumatized....he is still a loving little guy who still is allowed to bark when he feels it is necessary, like when the horses are out in the field across from my house.

BMDLuver
February 23rd, 2008, 08:57 AM
In that case we are not talking about the same product. I was thinking about the ones where the sound is audible to humans. I haven't met any one using one like what you're describing, if it works for you, great! Do you have a link you could share for it?

I think the one you are talking about is sold online through Pet Edge. I had never seen the one I bought before and we tested it at the store before purchasing it to make sure we could not hear it. I have my 85 year old father living with us and I did not want something that would drive him more nuts than the barking. I don't find an online link to it, perhaps it's too new?