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Weaning puppies

mrsdigger
January 14th, 2008, 09:17 PM
We have a pure bred golden lab who just had her first litter on December 14th, which makes our pups 4 weeks old. She had 10 puppies and all of them survived. She successfully nursed for one and a half weeks and then developed mastitis. Our vet treated her with antibiotics and the puppies continued to nurse with supervision to protect the infected teat. During her recovery another teat became inflamed and the milk was tainted pink. Within hours a small cut appeared and puss began to leak out and before we knew it she had a hole the size of a loonie on the side of her teat. The vet put her on a heavy duty penicilan and the pups could no longer nurse. I have been bottle feeding - now bowl feeding ever since. I found a wonderful home made formula on the internet and the pups are doing great. I am looking for suggestions on how to get the puppies onto kibble as I am going to go broke! Currently I am adding softened kibble to each meal. I want to make sure that the pups are getting enough to eat as I increase the kibble and decrease the formula. Does anyone have suggestions?

luckypenny
January 14th, 2008, 11:23 PM
If she was bred intentionally, this is one of the many reasons (amongst a dozen others) why most members here are against backyard breeding. People not prepared for the worst and the dogs/puppies suffering for it.

Now that that's out...every 2-3 days or so, decrease the amount of formula and increase the kibble. Within another 3 weeks, depending on their size and development, they should be on kibble only. If you haven't already done so, please provide them with fresh water at all times.

Have they seen a vet yet? It's highly recommended to rule out any medical issues you may not be aware of and he/she will guide you in what care they may need ie., deworming, vaccines, etc.

Please keep them all together until 8 weeks to ensure early proper peer socialization. The mother at this point is also important to her pups. Please do not separate her from them.

Please research early puppy socialization. I can not stress enough how crucial it is at this stage.

Hope their mom is better :fingerscr .

t.pettet
January 15th, 2008, 07:27 PM
:frustrated::frustrated::frustrated::frustrated:

bethaliz
January 16th, 2008, 08:25 AM
I'm sorry to hear about your dam having some much trouble with her milk. It's great that you are taking the time to hand feed them. One suggestion to help get them weaned a bit quicker.......

Before each bottle session, put down fresh mash (dry kibble wet down until it looks almost like soup) give them 30 mins or so and then bottle feed them. They will take less off the bottle as they will already be full.


When I wean and the pups get to 3/4 weeks this is what we do. The mother has less interest in being with the pups all the time so we allow her out for an hour or two. Before we put her back in we put down mash and give the pups a chance to eat some. After 30 mins we put the mom back in and she cleans up the rest of the food, while the pups feed from her. Once the are firmly eating the mash we slow reduce the amount of water, until by 8 weeks they have access to dry kibble all day and get wet down kibble (just wet enough to be soft) 3 times per day and no feeding from the mother.

It's the same principle for you, only you will bottle feed instead of allowing the mother to feed. I wish you all the best. Keep us posted about your babies.......post some pics too!

Corrie
January 16th, 2008, 10:38 AM
Most importantly...get you girl fixed ASAP and please make sure all new owners of your puppies will agree to have their dogs fixed as well!

10 more Goldens in the world...just what the Humane Societies love to hear! :sad:

A sad day!

bethaliz
January 16th, 2008, 02:40 PM
Most importantly...get you girl fixed ASAP and please make sure all new owners of your puppies will agree to have their dogs fixed as well!

10 more Goldens in the world...just what the Humane Societies love to hear! :sad:

A sad day!

Theres nothing to be done about it now. It doesn't mean we can't help and answer her questions. the dog probly should be fixed. Especially if she has a hard time mothering. I wouldn't breed her again. But it's not our call to make.

To the OP. If you are planning to pursue breeding in the furture, I would recommend finding a reputable breeder in your area to learn from. Most are happy to share their knowledge and will help you learn how to breed responsibly. I find most are happy to share their knowledge and are egar to welcome new people to the world of dogs. Note: most of the good ones are very aware of over population problems, are actively involved in rescue and will challenge you to do right by your dogs. They do not arbitrarily breed, the are contientious and carefully plan each litter, ensure they have homes prior to breeding, invest in showing, trailing, health and genetic testing etc. But they are your best resource and are really the best to look to.

All the best

luckypenny
January 16th, 2008, 02:53 PM
Theres nothing to be done about it now. It doesn't mean we can't help and answer her questions.

I agree, you're right, but that doesn't mean something like this can't be prevented in the future nor attempted to be discouraged. That's what many members, including myself, are concerned about.


... ensure they have homes prior to breeding...

:sorry::offtopic: So, that would mean a really good reputable experienced breeder wouldn't advertise on an on-line classified site such as...oh...kijiji for example?

bethaliz
January 16th, 2008, 04:19 PM
I agree, you're right, but that doesn't mean something like this can't be prevented in the future nor attempted to be discouraged. That's what many members, including myself, are concerned about.




:sorry::offtopic: So, that would mean a really good reputable experienced breeder wouldn't advertise on an on-line classified site such as...oh...kijiji for example?

I agree it can be prevented. I'll I was getting at was that the woman asked a question that no on answered. Everyone just told her not to breed and to spay the dog. Which is great, I agree. But it would be helpful to answer the question.....or at least direct her somewhere where she can get the information if you don't have it. That's all.

As for advertising, being reputable has little to do with where you advertise. Not all puppy homes can be found through word of mouth. It's more about the homes that are found, follow up care, testing, planned breedings, a willingness to take dogs back when homes don't work, being involved in rescue and supporting your breed. Advertising is a personal choice.

luckypenny
January 16th, 2008, 04:54 PM
...ensure they have homes prior to breeding...

As for advertising, being reputable has little to do with where you advertise..... Advertising is a personal choice.

Again, I agree with much of what you post except the above is a little confusing. If a reputable/responsible breeder has ensured homes prior to breeding, why does the need to advertise after the litter is born necessary. I was just researching some apparent reputable breeders and found them linked to online advertising sites that are notorious for byb ads. I just don't understand the association nor the necessity :confused: .

I agree it can be prevented. I'll I was getting at was that the woman asked a question that no on answered. Everyone just told her not to breed and to spay the dog. Which is great, I agree. But it would be helpful to answer the question.....or at least direct her somewhere where she can get the information if you don't have it. That's all.

I'm sorry, I thought that's what I did in my original post. Perhaps it was overlooked :shrug: .

Hopefully the OP will check back and consider everyone's responses :fingerscr .

bethaliz
January 16th, 2008, 10:08 PM
Again, I agree with much of what you post except the above is a little confusing. If a reputable/responsible breeder has ensured homes prior to breeding, why does the need to advertise after the litter is born necessary. I was just researching some apparent reputable breeders and found them linked to online advertising sites that are notorious for byb ads. I just don't understand the association nor the necessity :confused: .
.


Most do have homes set up in advance. Sometimes there are more pups than expected. Some advertise to GET people on their WAITING list. I know my mentor has advertised for years ONLY in the dog periodicals. She had more pups than expected and she did put an ad on kijiji, I don't think she knew (I didn't) that is is "known" for byb's. Another breeder from our local Kennel club said she advertised there and got a lot of calls. Simple as that. She still health tests, genetic tests, preplans, is involved in rescue, is willing to TAKE back ALL of her pups. No one's perfect, but WHERE you advertise isn't what makes you a BYB or a REPUTABLE breeder. I can tell you that more bybs advertise in dog annuals and periodicals than any online website.

It's sad that anyone asking a breeding question or answering one is insulted. We know there are dogs who need to be resuced and homed and loved etc. When I'm in a position to do it I will. I don't breed, I can't afford it. But I enjoying learning and working with my breeder. I have 1 dog and I have personally helped place over 10 rescue shih tzu's in the last 4 years. You don't always know what you're talking about when you start acussing people or putting them down. Think about it. You don't have to like me, but I'm not irresponsible.


[QUOTE=luckypenny;532067]
I'm sorry, I thought that's what I did in my original post. Perhaps it was overlooked :shrug: .
QUOTE]

I wasn't refering to you. I was refering to the indivdual who just said "spay ASAP" (that about sums up the whole comment).

Here's the thing you may not know. This site comes up FIRST when you're looking for a dong forum or ask a vet etc. So many people come here first to ask questions and they just get insulted. Education works a lot better than attacking people. And education through attack just makes people look ignorant and makes the op leave with their back up and then they don't listen.

I'm only a student......Maybe I don't have a clue. But I have a heart.

luckypenny
January 16th, 2008, 10:53 PM
Here's the thing you may not know. This site comes up FIRST when you're looking for a dong forum or ask a vet etc.

Yes I do know. This is how I first came across this site several years ago. Looking for answers on how to deal with a puppy I had bought from a byb who knew nothing about raising a litter of pups. I was in a position of total ignorance. I never posted out of shame because of the situation I had gotten myself into. But I did look at all the threads that were relevant. And I learned about what went wrong with our puppy from them. And I appreciated the honesty and the passion and the facts that many members offered to others. Through reading thoroughly and learning from them, I knew our only answer was to consult with professionals experienced with our problems.


You don't always know what you're talking about when you start acussing people or putting them down.

:confused: You've quoted me...are you not referring to me again here?

I believe that you can both answer a question and give your opinion at the same time. You can help in more than one way. If all one does is give an answer, how is another to learn what went wrong? My son makes a mistake on his exam. Will my giving him the right answer teach him anything? How will he learn if I don't give an explanation as to where he went wrong?

We all have hearts here. I can appreciate your effort and your honesty but you will give an answer based on your experiences. Some here have seen more atrocities than others and base their replies on the horrors they have witnessed. You can not blame them for the passion and anger you sense in their replies. You have to have a heart...and a clue as to what's going on.

mrsdigger
January 20th, 2008, 12:47 PM
Firstly, I need to address the fact that a forum is a place for public discussion and it is stated in this forum's rules that "Everyone who has an interest in pets is welcome on our board". No where does it state that you have to be a professional breeder or an owner of a specific breed. When is the last time that some of you reviewed the rules of this forum - especially the part on being kind? Secondly, something that I should have included in my original post that would have cleared up some assumptions that have been made about me and my situation is this...our female was scheduled to be spayed in the fall when a dear friend of ours who lost their lab earlier this year asked us to consider breeding her as they loved her disposition. After considering the pet overpopulation, we decided to go ahead because we had five other families interested in puppies. Six out of ten puppies were already spoken for prior to conception. We are not careless pet owner's who allowed their female to stray during her heat. This was a planned event with the exception of the unexpected health issues that occured after delivery. We used the stud services of a pure bred lab male with whom we know very well together with his bloodlines. So for you to think that my puppies who are hand raised by my family in our home are suffering in any fashion or that they will grow up to be less of a dog than one that came from a professional breeder is crazy. This so called "backyard breeder" - (what kind of world is this that you have a label such as that?) has done the best she can with an unfortunate situation. What do you do if you need financial advice? You turn to your financial adviser. What do you do if you net pet advice? Well clearly some of you have forgotten why you belong to this forum - but this is a place where people turn to when they needs answers to their pet questions not to be criticized, condemed or to be judged. For those who are genuinley interested in the well being of my female and her pups, I want you to know that she has healed 100% and the puppies according to my vet are the healthiest he has seen in quite some time. Thank you to those who offered advice - the weaning has been very successful. And yes, my female is scheduled to be spayed just as soon as her milk is dried up. No more puppies for this household!

LavenderRott
January 20th, 2008, 01:02 PM
Firstly, I need to address the fact that a forum is a place for public discussion and it is stated in this forum's rules that "Everyone who has an interest in pets is welcome on our board". No where does it state that you have to be a professional breeder or an owner of a specific breed. When is the last time that some of you reviewed the rules of this forum - especially the part on being kind? Secondly, something that I should have included in my original post that would have cleared up some assumptions that have been made about me and my situation is this...our female was scheduled to be spayed in the fall when a dear friend of ours who lost their lab earlier this year asked us to consider breeding her as they loved her disposition. After considering the pet overpopulation, we decided to go ahead because we had five other families interested in puppies. Six out of ten puppies were already spoken for prior to conception. We are not careless pet owner's who allowed their female to stray during her heat. This was a planned event with the exception of the unexpected health issues that occured after delivery. We used the stud services of a pure bred lab male with whom we know very well together with his bloodlines. So for you to think that my puppies who are hand raised by my family in our home are suffering in any fashion or that they will grow up to be less of a dog than one that came from a professional breeder is crazy. This so called "backyard breeder" - (what kind of world is this that you have a label such as that?) has done the best she can with an unfortunate situation. What do you do if you need financial advice? You turn to your financial adviser. What do you do if you net pet advice? Well clearly some of you have forgotten why you belong to this forum - but this is a place where people turn to when they needs answers to their pet questions not to be criticized, condemed or to be judged. For those who are genuinley interested in the well being of my female and her pups, I want you to know that she has healed 100% and the puppies according to my vet are the healthiest he has seen in quite some time. Thank you to those who offered advice - the weaning has been very successful. And yes, my female is scheduled to be spayed just as soon as her milk is dried up. No more puppies for this household!

You are right - a forum is a place to go to talk about and ask advice about whatever that forum is geared toward. Having said that - all forums have a different "atmosphere". I belong to two breed specific forums. One is very serious, deals with the different aspects of the breed and there is no room for shenanigans - you can't pm people, talk about your day etc. The other one is very loose and welcoming and while it deals with the same serious issues as the other forum, it is very much like a family offering support with weight loss, military deployments, illness, whatever.

This board has a LOT of members who do rescue work. I would venture to guess that 90% of the active members are active rescuers. With over 25,000 labrador retrievers listed on petfinder today - I am sure you can understand their indignation.

Ethical breeders are supported on this forum. By ethical, we mean - breeders who have shown their dogs to a title to show that it meets the standard, has done all genetic testing to make sure their dogs are as healthy as possible, and have shown their dogs in a proformance venue to show that the dog has the temperment to do the job that it was meant to do. Ethical breeders don't come here with questions though. They have either been breeding long enough to know what they are doing or they have mentors.

bethaliz
January 20th, 2008, 06:14 PM
I'm glad to hear that your girl is doing better. Thanks for the update. All the best with her spay.

Frenchy
January 20th, 2008, 07:05 PM
After considering the pet overpopulation, we decided to go ahead because we had five other families interested in puppies. Six out of ten puppies were already spoken for prior to conception.

Those people could have adopted from the humane society or rescues , but thanks to you they will not. LavenderRott explained it very well in her post, they are a lot of rescue people here , they volunteer their butts off because of people just like you , you bring more puppies to this already overcrowed pet world. And anyone has the right to reply in your thread , like you said , this is a public forum. :D

Purpledomino
January 20th, 2008, 08:37 PM
Just to add...........what you have is a Yellow Lab. It may actually be helpful to know the breed of dog you have, especially if you are making more of them. ;)

happycats
January 20th, 2008, 08:40 PM
Just to add...........what you have is a Yellow Lab. It may actually be helpful to know the breed of dog you have, especially if you are making more of them. ;)

Or it may be a golden retriever/ or maybe one parent is a yellow lab and the other a golden retriever:shrug: so even harder to place mutt pups :sad:

Purpledomino
January 20th, 2008, 08:59 PM
Or it may be a golden retriever/ or maybe one parent is a yellow lab and the other a golden retriever:shrug: so even harder to place mutt pups :sad:

Well if the dog is indeed a purebred as the OP stated, then she has a Yellow Labrador. :dog:

happycats
January 20th, 2008, 09:03 PM
Well if the dog is indeed a purebred as the OP stated, then she has a Yellow Labrador. :dog:

To bad the OP doesn't know that:shrug:

Frenchy
January 20th, 2008, 09:07 PM
We have a pure bred golden lab

Well if the dog is indeed a purebred as the OP stated, then she has a Yellow Labrador. :dog:

To bad the OP doesn't know that:shrug:

OMG I didn't even notice that :wall: a PURE golden lab :rolleyes: :headslap: :wall:

mrsdigger
January 20th, 2008, 09:51 PM
Never once have I pretended to be a breeder - if I were, I wouldn't be on here looking for advice such as basic weaning. Whether I call my dog a golden lab or a yellow lab - doesn't mean the world is going to come to an end - and yes, a professional breeder would know the difference - one of which I am not. If the best that you have to offer is making fun of other's then perhaps you should join a forum of teenagers - where that kind of behaviour is typical. In regards to the new owner's of our puppies not going to the SPCA to adopt a pet because of me - please be advised that if our SPCA had labs to adopt - then I would be in the wrong. You can't condem someone for wanting a specific breed. Clearly this forum has lost it's grace as it seems the majority of it's population is here to make fun of an unsuspecting individual who came here for advice. I simply wanted some advice - not a soap opera. What kind of dogs are you breeding - pit bulls?

14+kitties
January 20th, 2008, 10:07 PM
"Most people on this forum are against declawing cats, and are against banning specific dog breeds. Most people on this forum are VERY pro spay/neuter, and are against backyard breeding. Most people on this board will beg, borrow and max out their credit cards to see a veterinarian when their pets are ill. "

The above paragraph came from the listed rules.
Backyard breeding is not a word this forum came up with. It's been around for quite some time. Unfortumately there are a great number of them out there.
And there are some on this forum who have and do rescue pits or pit mixes. They deserve a chance as well.
I am glad your puppies are doing well and that most of them have homes. Have you found homes for the other four or are you keeping them yourselves to ensure they have a safe, forever home?

LavenderRott
January 21st, 2008, 12:04 AM
What kind of dogs are you breeding - pit bulls?

I sure hope that wasn't meant to be an insult. This is also a very pit bull friendly board.

happycats
January 21st, 2008, 06:03 AM
What kind of dogs are you breeding - pit bulls?


I think you missed our whole point........the majority of us DO NOT BREED, and are very pro spay/neuter. And what do pit bulls have to do with this:shrug:

mona_b
January 21st, 2008, 08:35 AM
our female was scheduled to be spayed in the fall when a dear friend of ours who lost their lab earlier this year asked us to consider breeding her as they loved her disposition. After considering the pet overpopulation, we decided to go ahead QUOTE]

Hmmmmmm,so for this reason it was ok to breed her????????..And even though you considered the pet overpopulation?????

What titles and health/genetic testing was done on both sire and dam????

I can tell you right now that your female(and even the male) did not come from a reputable breeder.Reputable breeders have a s/n contract which many say they must be done by a year old.A non-breeding contract is lifted from the breeder and only the breeder.And that's done once there are titles behind them and and they are health/genetic tested and certified.

I was on a neuter contract with my 3 boys.They were to be done at 6 months,if not I would have been taken to court and fined $5000.And yes,a breeder CAN do this..

[QUOTE]Whether I call my dog a golden lab or a yellow lab - doesn't mean the world is going to come to an end - and yes, a professional breeder would know the difference - one of which I am not.

Why didn't you ask your so called breeder these questions?That's what they are there for.

babykitten
March 1st, 2008, 06:30 PM
pick of your choice of puppie food and soak it in hot water to make much and don't drain the water out it takes way from the nutrients . dont over feed to much will cause diarrhea. pick an amount thats good for there size and age.once you noticed they eat it with less water added less and less as they get there teeth stop putting:thumbs up water in and serve them with no water hope this helps

babykitten
March 1st, 2008, 06:32 PM
We have a pure bred golden lab who just had her first litter on December 14th, which makes our pups 4 weeks old. She had 10 puppies and all of them survived. She successfully nursed for one and a half weeks and then developed mastitis. Our vet treated her with antibiotics and the puppies continued to nurse with supervision to protect the infected teat. During her recovery another teat became inflamed and the milk was tainted pink. Within hours a small cut appeared and puss began to leak out and before we knew it she had a hole the size of a loonie on the side of her teat. The vet put her on a heavy duty penicilan and the pups could no longer nurse. I have been bottle feeding - now bowl feeding ever since. I found a wonderful home made formula on the internet and the pups are doing great. I am looking for suggestions on how to get the puppies onto kibble as I am going to go broke! Currently I am adding softened kibble to each meal. I want to make sure that the pups are getting enough to eat as I increase the kibble and decrease the formula. Does anyone have suggestions?
ya make mush kibble soaked in hot water it works great :thumbs up

happycats
March 1st, 2008, 09:40 PM
Is there a reason why you're brining up all these old threads?? It seems like all the old threads your answering are ones about breeding, and you see by the replies this is a pro spay/neuter forum, so I just don't get why your are posting :shrug:

Frenchy
March 1st, 2008, 09:55 PM
Is there a reason why you're brining up all these old threads?? It seems like all the old threads your answering are ones about breeding, and you see by the replies this is a pro spay/neuter forum, so I just don't get why your are posting :shrug:

You've noticed that too hey ?

:wall:

happycats
March 1st, 2008, 10:25 PM
Like every old breeding thread!! :clown: strange night.

Frenchy
March 1st, 2008, 10:26 PM
Like every old breeding thread!! :clown: strange night.

Hold on , spring break is coming :cool:

happycats
March 1st, 2008, 10:28 PM
Hold on , spring break is coming :cool:

Spring.......Tis the season for BYB:mad::wall:

rainbow
March 1st, 2008, 11:09 PM
Spring.......Tis the season for BYB:mad::wall:

And also :loser:'s

Shaykeija
March 1st, 2008, 11:29 PM
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j42/twistedstrawbery/Trollbutton.jpg


LOL

wdawson
March 2nd, 2008, 08:20 AM
What kind of dogs are you breeding - pit bulls?


why do people always reference pitbulls in a negative way :wall: its this mentallity that contributed to the ban:evil: