Pets.ca - Pet forum for dogs cats and humans 

-->

Thinking about leaving Czarina to roam free tonight

ancientgirl
January 7th, 2008, 08:07 PM
Czarina has spent most of the evening laying or sleeping on one of the orange chairs. While she's still hissed at everyone who has gone near her, I've tried to be there to say "No, not nice, no hissing" And I'll usually say something like "Maks is a nice kitty, or Vlad just wants to be your friend."

LOL, she'll just look at me, so I'm guessing all she hears is something akin to what Charlie Brown's parents always sounded like in the cartoons.

Anyway, I'm thinking I may let her just be around to roam overnight and just get her back into her enclosure in the morning.

I figured, I have to do this at some point, and I'll be sleeping but I'll still be here. Maks and Kiska are cautious of her and they spend most of the night on the bed with me anyway, so I'm hoping for the best.

Do you guys think I'm trying to do this too quickly? Should I wait another few days? Maybe another full weekend?

otter
January 7th, 2008, 08:22 PM
You know Czarina best... go with your gut.

If you are at all hesitant i'd wait another couple of days, can't hurt to wait and you definitely want this to be as hissy fit free as possible. If Czarina gets in a spat with one of the other kitties it's going to take twice as much work to help her over it again.

Good luck to you and the kitties whatever you decide:fingerscr:fingerscr:goodvibes::goodvibes:

Kristin7
January 7th, 2008, 08:23 PM
Well, it may be ok, but if I were you, the first time doing this, make sure you don't have anything important to do the next day that you need to be awake for. You may be up all night worrying or listening to cats screaming at each other. Until we put my boyfriends cat back in her own room for the night, I was losing a lot of sleep. She is new to the house and slow to adapt, she kept escaping at night, I was worried they would get in a huge fight and we'd be sleeping, slow to break it up. Plus, they ALL want to sleep with us, and none of the cats like each other, so you can imagine how that goes! :crazy: Then she starting peeing/pooping on the rug in the hallway... So we are just letting her out again now, supervised only, not at night while we are trying to sleep. If you do this tonight, good luck! :fingerscr

ancientgirl
January 7th, 2008, 08:30 PM
Kristin7 you have a point. I should probably wait until the weekend, just in case there is any fighting.

Otter, since Kiska was the one hurt last time, I think I should wait until this weekend when she sees the vet. I've got to take her and Maks for their last booster and I'll have them look at where they stitched her up after her spay.

I think in the meantime the evening breaks from her enclosure may give her the time she needs so that when I do allow her out full time she will be more comfortable.

Thanks guys.

Frenchy
January 7th, 2008, 08:36 PM
You know Czarina best... go with your gut.



That goes from me too.

dmc123
January 7th, 2008, 08:47 PM
That goes from me too.

I ditto those that said go with your gut feelings on this.....

Diane

ancientgirl
January 7th, 2008, 08:54 PM
I went to pick her up and she hissed at me and ran towards her enclosure. So that told me what I needed to know. I briefly wondered if I should just hiss back at her when she hisses at me, but I don't know if that would be considered a threat to her or if it's like saying, cut it out and don't mess with me I'm the boss.

I'll have to wait a little longer for that. At least she's feeling comfortable enough to not be in the pyramid constantly so I'll have to be happy with that for now, since it is progress.

Frenchy
January 7th, 2008, 09:05 PM
I briefly wondered if I should just hiss back at her when she hisses at me, but I don't know if that would be considered a threat to her or if it's like saying, cut it out and don't mess with me I'm the boss.



I would with a dog :laughing: but not with a cat , they're too fussy :laughing:

Dracko
January 7th, 2008, 10:52 PM
Yeah, I don't think that would work with a cat - hissing back. Would probably make you seem scary to her.

I think she has figured out the enclosure is her safe place. They say that a new cat should have one and be slowly introduced. Sounds to me that she has figured things out and is content to go stay there for now.

rainbow
January 8th, 2008, 02:26 AM
Yeah, I don't think that would work with a cat - hissing back. Would probably make you seem scary to her.

I think she has figured out the enclosure is her safe place. They say that a new cat should have one and be slowly introduced. Sounds to me that she has figured things out and is content to go stay there for now.

I agree and I don't think she's ready to have any night time freedom yet. I would wait until the weekend to see how much more improvement there has been.

growler~GateKeeper
January 8th, 2008, 04:28 AM
I think you need to find a way to securely block her from reaching the top of the stairs when you do allow Czarina out @ night. Allow her up to the top couple of stairs at first just not into the bedroom (Kiskas' current safe place), since you mentioned in another thread earlier that she already tried to go up there, she will try it again.

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 05:41 AM
As it turns out, she managed to yet again get out of her enclosed area. She got out of the other side, which I thought was secure as well. When I approached her she just ran towards the orange chair.

I hesitantly decided to just allow her to stay out. The gang all went upstairs with me and stayed up there all night. I even found Vlad had wormed his way onto my pillow LOL.

But they allowed her her space and she didn't go any further than her chair.

This morning I went to get her and she just jumped down and went to her area. I secured the vulnerable area with the microwave. Hopefully that will work.

I guess she just didn't want to be in there all night anymore, and she liked the comfy orange chair. At least she left the others alone and they her.

I hope to make some strides this weekend. She'll have been here about 3 weeks and I think she's grown comfortable here, or at least she feels some kind of security.

OH, and I won't hiss at her.:D

clm
January 8th, 2008, 06:08 AM
She's obviously claimed that chair. They all have their favorite places don't they.
Sounds like she's making great progress. :thumbs up

Cindy

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 06:30 AM
LOL, yeah, the good thing is there are two of them. She's quite comfortable there.

Love4himies
January 8th, 2008, 06:44 AM
If you are at all hesitant I would not allow her to be free with your resident kitties. One fight could set you back a couple of weeks and you will have to start all over. I've had to do that with Puddles and Sweet Pea because of an altercation between them and it has been 6 months of them being in the same household (Puddles would hiss at her kittens, Sweet Pea would try to attack Puddles). Everytime, there was an altercation, I would have to start from square one again. Ended up that I had to keep one of them locked up all the time.

Now that the kittens are gone, I have Sweet Pea on a harness and leash around the house to reintroduce Puddles and Sweet Pea. It means I don't get to sit down and relax, but does allow Puddles and Sweet Pea to be in the same room and no fights. Puddles won't attack Sweet Pea, but will hiss, Sweet Pea then will go after Puddles, so with the leash I have control over Sweet Pea. When Puddles hisses, I distract Sweet Pea with a treat or toy and give Sweet Pea praise when she doesn't react to Puddles. Puddles relaxes when she sees that Sweet Pea is distracted. Puddles gets a praise when she doesn't hiss at Sweet Pea. Sweet Pea is locked up in her room at night and while we are out of the house.

Poor Czarina she is probably so scared and needs lots of reassurance from you. You know she is safe, but she has to learn over time.

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 07:59 AM
I wanted to leave her out last night, because the previous night she'd tried to get out. I think she doesn't want to stay in her little area anymore at night. It is next to the front door, so she hears some street noise, and if you are next to the door you can hear the metro train and of course anyone walking or running by. I'm thinking she might feel like she can't get away, and since it's dark that might frighten her more.

When she got out last night, I felt it might scare her more if I grabbed her and put her back in. She made a beeline for the chair though, so I think she just wanted to feel secure and comfortable and I left her there.

The gang kept themselves with me on the bed so there were no altercations. This morning she went back to her area with no problems at all. I think she feels better there alone during the day, and the others can still see her and she can see them.

I'd love for her to allow them to approach her and not feel she needs to defend herself. But I know that will come in time.

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 08:42 AM
It's still a huge step forward from the Kiska-fight post! Remember how upset you were, and almost ready to place her in a one-cat home somewhere? And now look at her! They are all getting used to her, even if the little ones are a bit more respectful (not to say scared necessarily), and she's obviously decided that that chair is hers!

You should be in for an interesting weekend ... in 4 days!

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 08:46 AM
That was horrible. I have to say, I won't put up with any of my resident cats being hurt. I just can't deal with knowing I've brought a cat into the household that could potentially harm them. This is where they feel safe, they should not feel afraid. But so far there have been no altercations. What's funny is, she hisses at all of them, but for instance, she immediately took to sleeping in the pyramid bed, which is filled with Maks' scent. Then the first orange chair she made herself comfy in had been used repeatedly by Maks and Kiska on several occasions. Vlad and Oksana also sleep in either of the two orange chairs, so those chairs have their scent on it.

I'm thinking maybe she will soon be comfortable with the gang's scent. Last Sunday I put some baby powder scented spray on my hands and brushed all of them down with it, so they would all have that same scent. I'm going to do it again tonight.

Since she's feeling more comfortable walking around, I'm hoping she will begin to see the others as less of a threat to her.

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 08:51 AM
I think she already is. I've had a good feeling about this from the start, even with the fight, don't know why, I can't explain it, just a feeling ...

Misti was cute last night. As we were attempting to find something worth watching on TV, she was on my lap, purring away. Suddenly she noticed that Spoutnik was on the afghan at the other end of the couch, sleeping alone. She jumped down, went over and jumped back up, to curl up around him! It was so sweet :lovestruck:

And the camera is out of batteries, so no pics :sad:

This morning, they ate from the same plate when I put the canned food out. I think the weekend they spend with all of us others gone, made them bond :D they had only eachother for company, and who wants to spend 2 days all alone?

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 09:04 AM
I think she already is. I've had a good feeling about this from the start, even with the fight, don't know why, I can't explain it, just a feeling ...

Misti was cute last night. As we were attempting to find something worth watching on TV, she was on my lap, purring away. Suddenly she noticed that Spoutnik was on the afghan at the other end of the couch, sleeping alone. She jumped down, went over and jumped back up, to curl up around him! It was so sweet :lovestruck:

And the camera is out of batteries, so no pics :sad:

This morning, they ate from the same plate when I put the canned food out. I think the weekend they spend with all of us others gone, made them bond :D they had only eachother for company, and who wants to spend 2 days all alone?

I hope your feeling along with Winston's are both right. She's still on outside kitty defensive mode. I try to let her see me playing and kissing the others so that she sees this is a happy and safe place for her. One thing she did yesterday which I thought might be very positive is she rubbed her nose with mine. That's got to be a good sign.

I'm sure Misti decided while you guys were gone the the little Spout isn't all that bad, and like you said, nobody wants to spend 2 days alone.

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 09:19 AM
One thing she did yesterday which I thought might be very positive is she rubbed her nose with mine. That's got to be a good sign.

She's claiming you as hers, marking you with her scent! Great sign :thumbs up

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 09:31 AM
LOL, I must have then 5 different scents on my face.:D

I thought it was so cute last night. I woke up and found Vlad completely on my pillow. His head was right on my cheek, and his little front paws were stretched out on my chest. :cloud9:

amatazes
January 8th, 2008, 11:35 AM
i love that your cats have russian names. my next batch of animals are going to be themed. maybe indian? no, scandinavian!!!

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 11:37 AM
I felt it made would make them be more like real brothers and sisters if they had names that were ethnically the same.

krdahmer
January 8th, 2008, 01:33 PM
Well sounds like things are getting a wee bit smoother over there... thats great!:thumbs up

Baby steps may not get you there quickly.... but they get you there safely! ;)

How are things today? She parked on the orange chair?

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 01:50 PM
Bah, I accidentally closed the tab I was writing this in and lost what I'd written!

What I'd said was she was on the orange chair nearest the window this morning. She won't sleep in her pyramid anymore while she's allowed to roam outside her little area. Vlad and Maks however take turns going in there:laughing:

I figured, this evening I'd just allow her to be out. If I tried to put her in her area this evening, she's probably try again to get out, and I don't want her to hurt herself doing that. I feel also, if I don't allow her some freedom she will never truly get used to the apartment or the others.

The little ones are cautious around her, and most of the time when they are downstairs, Vlad is there as well, watching. I have a picture I'll try to remember to post when I get home. Czarina was sitting under the new blue kitty play thing. It has a tube they all like laying in, especially Maks, and he slowly crept in there to not alert her he was that close to her. But Kiska was sitting about 2 feet away. Czarina was just watching her, but then I noticed Vlad came and sat down right next to Kiska and stayed next to Tiny Miss until she got bored and went off to do something else.

I think little by little I just have to trust that they will set their own boundaries and she will realize that this is her home, and those kitties are her new family.

14+kitties
January 8th, 2008, 01:58 PM
Wow girl!!! What a change from a week and a half ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wonderful! There are still going to be setbacks along the way but I would think all in all you can consider this a success! In about 6 months you are going to look back on these posts and have a great laugh. :) WTG!!!

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 02:04 PM
Wow girl!!! What a change from a week and a half ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wonderful! There are still going to be setbacks along the way but I would think all in all you can consider this a success! In about 6 months you are going to look back on these posts and have a great laugh. :) WTG!!!

I really hope so. This will be one time in their lives I will not mind blanking on. I'll be thrilled when the day comes when I know there is truly some harmony going on.

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 02:20 PM
i love that your cats have russian names. my next batch of animals are going to be themed. maybe indian? no, scandinavian!!!

If you go with Scandinavian, gimme a shout :thumbs up seeing that I am Norwegian after all ... even if half French too ... and living in Montreal ... where are the frontiers?

Cats aren't dumb. In fact, they are pretty intelligent creatures. Czarina I'm sure, has already got this all figured out in her little pretty head, it's just a question of finding her place in this gang of five "mouse-keteers" and settling in.

I like Vlad's protectiveness towards Kiska! I'll bet that's how he got the scratch that night too, protecting her. Extra portion of cream and fish for Vlad!

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 02:38 PM
I don't doubt he saw something he didn't like and stepped in. Before I got Czarina, Maks was trying to get dominant on Oksana, and Vlad immediately stepped in. Mind you, he likes Maks and is always playing with him, but my sweet Vlad won't put up with any :censored: from anybody. LOL

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 04:14 PM
Guess he's the Tzar off all of Purrland :cat:

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 05:25 PM
He is of this purrland :D

http://dl2.glitter-graphics.net/pub/139/139802l7i8deu8tc.gif (http://www.glitter-graphics.com)

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 05:41 PM
I saved that pic!

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 05:55 PM
I found it here:

Glitter Graphics (http://www.glitter-graphics.com/gallery.php?categoryID=54)

That kitty looks just like my Vlad.

SARAH
January 8th, 2008, 05:56 PM
You know, I wish you didn't live so darned far away! I have a feeling we'd have some great times visiting if we lived closer ... oh well, there's always the forum :thumbs up

ancientgirl
January 8th, 2008, 05:58 PM
Yeah, I've met so many really great people over the internet. I wish I loved closer to some people. It would be nice to visit.

14+kitties
January 9th, 2008, 09:50 AM
How did Czarina make out last night? Did she sleep on "her" chair or in her enclosure?

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 09:56 AM
She slept in her chair actually. At one point, the gang were downstairs making all kinds of noise, so I went to turn the lights on and she was just hanging out in her chair.

This morning she came up into my room and started hissing at the little ones, but when I saw her growling, I gave her a firm "No" and she went back downstairs.

I also bought some calming lavender spray, which is to help keep the dander down and also to keep them calm. So I sprayed some on my hand and put some on everyone. I can alternate between this and the baby powder I have until they all figure, "hey we all smell alike"

Last night I was petting her and she tried to swat at me at one point. I simply told her she wasn't being nice and walked away. I figured, I'm not going to keep petting her when she hisses or swats at me, as she might see it as acceptable behavior. So I just walk away and come back later.

Jim Hall
January 9th, 2008, 10:12 AM
lol its sort of like a toddler testing thier limits isn't it

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 10:15 AM
It really is. But I have to be more patient with her, because she hasn't had any boundaries for so long. She's really starting at square one.

SARAH
January 9th, 2008, 10:26 AM
Sounds like you're doing great though!! :thumbs up all 6 of 'ya!

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 10:45 AM
Yeah, little by little. I did see her using her litter box this morning but I didn't want to go in and show her how to bury her poop like I did with Vlad and Oksana when they were kittens. I think once I am able to get them all together without her hissing at everyone, she might learn by example.

I'm happy she's using that box too, because even though I have it there for her, the others go in there freely, when she's out roaming the rest of the apartment. So she thankfully has no problems using a box used by the others.

Once I am able to allow her to roam freely all the time, I'm taking that box out of the half bath, and putting it under the stairs. I'm going to make some kind of curtains with some fabric and some velcro, that way I can keep the box there and keep it concealed to a degree.

That will be 3 boxes for 5 cats. I know I should have one per cat, but I just wouldn't have the room, and for me to keep the screen up like I used to in order to keep them from getting out the door, I have to keep the bathroom door shut.

But *knock on wood* as of now, I haven't had any problems with anybody sharing or attacking anyone while they are using the litter. In fact, sometimes when one is using it, another will come in and check out what they are doing. LOL, I even caught Maks and Kiska using it at the same time once.

SARAH
January 9th, 2008, 10:49 AM
LOL, I even caught Maks and Kiska using it at the same time once.

LOL, a "lost pic" moment :laughing:

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 11:06 AM
I'm telling you, I need a camera in every room!

When I first brought home Maks and Kiska, I did find it cute that Vlad would bury their poop, but they watched him and learned. So I'm hoping Czarina will do the same.

krdahmer
January 9th, 2008, 11:57 AM
Hey can Vlad come over and teach my guys too? Mine are all of the drop it and run variety.... very few get buried. :yuck::rolleyes:

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 12:03 PM
LOL, hey, they've got busy lives, what with all the eating, napping and playing they have to do. They don't have time to bury any poop!

You know, at this point though, I'm just happy Czarina knows to go in the litter box.

I was telling my next door neighbor yesterday that I took her in, and the first thing she asked me was about the litter. She said her mom took in a stray once that never used the box. All the more evidence to me that she was at one point in indoor kitty.

14+kitties
January 9th, 2008, 12:56 PM
All the more evidence to me that she was at one point in indoor kitty.


But not necessarily. It took us a while to get the idea to keep my babies safe from harm. Until that they were allowed to run around the property. When I finally INSISTED that we needed to find some way of keeping them safe we put them in the garage and blocked off all areas of escape. Up to that point they had been using the great outdoors as their litterbox. More exact, my gardens. :rolleyes: Once they were in the garage they started using the litterboxes with no problems. Kitties are pretty amazing little angels.

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 12:58 PM
Do they bury their poop? That's my big issue with Czarina and the litter box. She doesn't cover it.

14+kitties
January 9th, 2008, 01:00 PM
I would say most of them do. And if they don't there is someone not far behind that does. :o And it's not me!! :laughing:

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 01:03 PM
Yeah, that's what I figure. I'm hoping when she becomes more friendly the same thing will happen. Like I said above, Vlad used to cover Kiska's when she'd forget. :D

Love4himies
January 9th, 2008, 01:10 PM
LOL, I even caught Maks and Kiska using it at the same time once.
When my foster kittens were younger, they used to line up to use the litter box :laughing:.

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 01:13 PM
LOL, such good manners.

I'll be in the bathroom and they will all take turns. One will use it, the other will look in, sniff and get close to where the action is happening, then when the occupant is done, someone else will come in.

I know cat's like privacy, but since I've kept the litter box in my bathroom since I got Vlad and Oksana, and now Maks and Kiska, they have no issues going when I'm in there or when another cat is in there. My kitties are exhibitionists:laughing:

chico2
January 9th, 2008, 02:15 PM
It's the same in my house,Rocky will wait for Chico to finish,the same with Vinnie,really cute.

Ancient,it seems to me,you and Czarina have come a long way:thumbs up
My cats,although they are now sleeping side by side in the sun by the window,often have hissy-fits,that probably will not change,but no real cat-fights.
Czarina might never completely stop hissing ever now and then,but that is certainly no big deal,just ask any multi-cat owner.
Vlad seems like such a prince,a wonderful kitty:lovestruck:

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 03:15 PM
Yes, I think we've come a long way. Hopefully as the weeks go by she will be more and more comfortable.

Vlad is the love of my life. I never thought I could love anything in this world more than I love that kitty.:lovestruck: I love all of them, but Vlad, well he's my special boy.

chico2
January 9th, 2008, 03:56 PM
ancient,I feel the same about Rocky,although I've had a lot of problems with him,there is just a special bond.:lovestruck:

ancientgirl
January 9th, 2008, 05:04 PM
I used to feel guilty. But I did realize a long time ago I love all of them dearly. But there is nothing wrong with having a special bond with one in particular.

growler~GateKeeper
January 9th, 2008, 11:51 PM
3 weeks already huh? wow time flies!

About the burying of the poop - could be her way of territorial scent marking from living outside. Most cats will cover their poop so other cats do not know there is a cat in the area (that's why they scoop until they can't smell it even after it doesn't show on top), but when you have a territorial cat they may not cover the poop to mark their space.

Duffy most of the time will cover occasionally she doesn't, I have noticed when we visit my mum & she goes outside she usually doesn't cover - sort of a warning to the neighbourhood cats. :cat:

ancientgirl
January 10th, 2008, 05:17 AM
Okay, that makes sense to me. LOL, but mine apparently don't know that rule, because they go in her box ALL the time:laughing:

growler~GateKeeper
January 11th, 2008, 12:34 AM
:laughing: maybe cuz it's NEW :cool:, plus it's in a new place too :shrug: Good that she doesn't have any issues w/them going in there too :highfive:


Should also have mentioned sometimes they don't cover it outside because they are going on grass & there's nothing to cover it with, not all cats outside make the effort to dig a hole :D