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List of Taser Deaths - past two months

CearaQC
December 7th, 2007, 12:35 PM
So sad... And 3 in one day!

Sammy Baker - Quitman, Georgia - Oct. 1, 2007
Veteran Sammy Baker, 59, was Tased by an officer outside a convenience store in Quitman, Georgia, causing him to fall to the ground. The fall caused Baker to dislocate and fracture his spinal cord and ended in his death.

Robert Dziekanski - Vancouver, Canada - Oct. 14, 2007
A 40-year-old Polish immigrant who spoke no English, Dziekanski became distraught when he couldn't connect with his mother at the Vancouver International Airport. The Royal Canadian Mounted Police arrived on the scene and, after only 20 seconds and no attempt to investigate the situation, began Tasing him. Even after he had fallen to the ground and was restrained, police continued to Tase him, resulting in his death.

Quilem Registre - Montreal, Canada - Oct. 17, 2007
Registre, 38, was Tased on Oct. 14 during a traffic stop. Police say he was intoxicated and aggressive and that they used the Taser in order to subdue him. He went to the hospital in critical condition and died three days later.

Jarrel Gray - Frederick, Maryland - Nov. 18, 2007
Police responded to a fight between four people in an apartment complex in Frederick, Maryland. Gray, 20, was Tased and fell unconscious. He was taken to the hospital were he was pronounced dead.

Christian Allen - Jacksonville, Florida - Nov. 18, 2007
Allen was pulled over by police for playing music too loud in his truck. Allen reportedly shoved an officer before he and his passenger ran away. He was Tased after a struggle with the officers. He went into cardiac arrest and died.

Jesse Saenz - Albuquerque, New Mexico - Nov. 18, 2007
Police say 20-year-old Jesse Saenz struggled with officers and that they had no choice but to Tase him. They say they Tased him only once. However, a witness says there was no struggle and that the police Tased Saenz for about five minutes. Saenz was transported to the county detention center where he died.

Unidentifed Man - Jacksonville, Florida - Nov. 20. 2007
A man whose identity has not been released fled the scene of a car crash and tried to break into a nearby home. The man reportedly fought with the officer and tried to bite him. The officer Tased him three times. He was pronounced dead at the hospital.

Howard Hyde - Halifax, Nova Scotia - Nov. 22, 2007
Hyde, a paranoid schizophrenic who had gone off his medication, was Tased by police during booking after they said he became unruly. He died a day later.

Robert Knipstrom - British Columbia, Canada - Nov. 24, 2007
The 36-year-old British Columbia resident died in the hospital four days after being Tased, pepper sprayed, and beaten with batons by Canadian police after acting agitated and combative in a store.

http://politics.healthdiaries.com/list-of-taser-deaths-over-the-past-two-months.html

Frenchy
December 7th, 2007, 12:36 PM
omg this is what I need when I go grocery shopping :evil:

CearaQC
December 7th, 2007, 12:53 PM
No doubt huh?

What's more scary that not a lot of people know... but there is now a projectile taser system that can be shot out of a 12 gauge shotgun, up to 100 feet.

:eek:

http://www.taser.com/products/law/Pages/XREP.aspx

It's like they get a thrill out of hurting people or something.

Masha
December 7th, 2007, 01:09 PM
omg this is what I need when I go grocery shopping :evil:

:laughing: Who is it there that you dislike so much?

SARAH
December 7th, 2007, 01:20 PM
:laughing: Who is it there that you dislike so much?

All the bl:censored: idiots who leave their carts all over the place so normal shoppers can't move; kids with the mini-carts; and kids running the marathon between the aisles!

For starters.

CearaQC
December 7th, 2007, 01:42 PM
Don't forget the parking lot! Carts in a parking spot so you can't pull in. Carts clear across the parking lot or even across the street.

People that don't look when they turn aisles and bump into you and act like you're in THEIR way.

I always make comments where employees can hear.

"They never carry _______ product. This store sucks."

:laughing:

Ford Girl
December 7th, 2007, 02:51 PM
You guys are either talking about the Super Store or Costco right? :laughing:

Frenchy
December 8th, 2007, 11:26 AM
You guys are either talking about the Super Store or Costco right? :laughing:

I'm talking about EVERY PUBLIC PLACES :laughing:

But really , I think they should keep using those Taser guns but they could make them less .... "effective" :2cents: :shrug:

CearaQC
December 8th, 2007, 11:28 AM
Tasers don't kill... it's the overzealous, trigger happy sadistic cops!

I guess the old-fashioned way of beating the snot out of someone with the nightstick isn't popular any more.

:laughing:

Frenchy
December 8th, 2007, 11:34 AM
I guess the old-fashioned way of beating the snot out of someone with the nightstick isn't popular any more.

:laughing:

Causes too much blood / abuse proofs :laughing:

Bearsmom
December 10th, 2007, 06:17 AM
It's like they get a thrill out of hurting people or something.

I'm asking you to remove that comment from your last post. I'm a former police officer and took absolutely NO pleasure in having to hurt someone. Ever.

Tasers were introduced after my time on the department. There exists a "use of force" continuum where by a person's actions are met with some level on the use of force continuum. For example, if you're just yelling at me as an officer, am I going to shoot you? No, I'm going to use the appropriate "level of force" which in this case would be me just trying to talk you into doing what I need you to do.

If you threaten my life, damn straight am I going to do whatever is necessary to ensure my butt was going home at the end of the shift.

What I could never figure out is that most of the cases where the tasers were used, wouldn't it have gone much easier if the person had just complied?

I'm not saying in every case, but then again I WASN'T THERE, so it's a little tough to pass judgement based on what the media twists an incident into.

Love4himies
December 10th, 2007, 07:56 AM
I am on the cops side on this one, what is the alternative to get an aggressive person to comply??? Let him/her go? Let him/her hurt a cop? All the person has to do is comply. The cops are doing enough risking of their lives, and they need some protection, lets face it, it is not the boy scout they are dealing with, but those who would not hesitate to kill, or are so high on drugs they are a danger to society. There needs to be some type of control in society.

chico2
December 10th, 2007, 08:19 AM
I have to say,in the case of Robert Dziekanski,he was NOT violent,no threat to the lives of all those officers.
The man was confused and rightfully upset after having waited in a bare room for 10 hours,while his mother was told he's not there.
I always thought officers have special training to calm down or take down an irrational person,this man was not out to hurt anyone,had no weapon:sad:
I am usually 100% for the police,they are dealing with threatening,dangerous situations every day,but that is what they are trained for,that's what policeofficers do.
I cannot see why 4(I think there was 4)police-officers could not calm this man down without killing him,it was a really sad case to me:sad:

Frenchy
December 10th, 2007, 12:30 PM
I agree with you Chico2. Not all of them (police) but some of them do come out way too strong !

Bearsmom , have you seen what happen to Robert Dziekanski ? This is the one in Vancouver right ? Well I saw the footage , and it's obvious to me , they went way too hard on that poor guy. It was 100% police brutality , and that's what CearaQC is talking about and she shouldn't have to delete her post. She was not saying : all policemen/women are brutal. :shrug: just some of them.

Love4himies
December 10th, 2007, 01:22 PM
We only see what the media allows us to see and we don't see what has led up to the taser incidents. Stories are like pancakes, no matter how flat they are, there are always two sides. Can police use excessive force, yes I imagine they may, but they are only human and they have seen more than I am sure any of us had and we shouldn't be judging unless we have been in that situation. Like I said they are human, not robots, and have emotions and adrenalin (sp??) flowing when the situation gets violent and unintentional things may happen and police officers may do something that they would not have normally, and regret what they do in the situation. It is so easy for people to sit in their cozy lazyboys and judge when not in that situation. I am not refering to anything one incident by the way, just in general.

CearaQC
December 10th, 2007, 01:45 PM
The best way is to not pay attention to the media. They are all huge corporations that filter stories to suit their own purposes. It all boils down to just a few individuals what gets shown on TV.

The best evidence of problems with some police are videos, both patrol car cameras and unedited cell phone or camera videos that are uploaded online daily. Anyone can request a copy of a patrol car video if they are in it, like that one guy did recently and went through the mass media frenzy for a few days while his video was being shown. I forget his name...

Not all cops are bad. But yes there are some that are sadistic and enjoy hurting people. The thing to remember is those people are encouraged to act that way. They may enter the police force well intending to do the right thing, but after indoctrination in the system, they turn into not-so-nice people. All this fear is artificially induced and people are buying into it sooo easily and are thus called "sheeple." It's called Problem-Reaction-Solution. "Why don't THEY do anything about this crime. Why don't THEY solve this problem." Then the government steps in and says, "Ok we'll take care of this but you must lose your rights first." Then... everyone is screwed.

Saying "Why don't they" all the time is a symptom of apathy and lack of personal responsibility, always looking for someone else to be a savior while the rest just kick back, watch, and do nothing. It becomes an open invitation to allow government to control every aspect of people's lives.

Stress from the job also brings out the worst in people. When you live daily with stressful situations, anyone is bound to wig out now and then. Today they call it Post Traumatic Stress disorder. But the same problem had another name back from WW1, called Shell Shock.

I don't say these things to fuel an argument...I say these things to share information in order to help people. I'm a very loving person, but this typing on a forum is relatively cold and lacks true representation of the self. If the truth hurts, then I'm sorry, but don't kill the messenger. Please take the time to self-educate about every possible thing you can think of and stop relying on others to spoon feed information. I know it's hard... with work, family, kids, illnesses, pets, bills, taxes... IMO nothing is more important than self education.

Please take the time to watch this video, and then it will all make more sense regarding the use of tasers. It's called the Shock Doctrine, with a book by the same name authored by Naomi Klein, a Canadian woman I think.

http://www.naomiklein.org/shock-doctrine/short-film

http://www.naomiklein.org/shock-doctrine

jesse's mommy
December 10th, 2007, 04:22 PM
I have a stun gun that I carry with me while I'm working. They've realigned our sales routes and now I'm expected to go into highly questionable areas alone. I refuse to be in these areas before the sun rises or after the sun sets and I carry my stun gun on my hip while I'm there. It's a million volts and I have no problem shocking the sh$t out of someone if they try to attack me. :evil:

(And yes, in Florida it's legal to carry these as long as you are over 18 and remember, it's a stun gun, not a taser.)

chico2
December 10th, 2007, 04:35 PM
I have personally dealt with the police on several occasion,because of my epileptic son.
He tried to live a"normal"life but would often have seizures while out on his own at night,no drinking or drugs,he did neither..
After a seizure however,he would get up,act very irrational,confused etc..
He was even handcuffed and thrown in jail a couple of times,I do not blame the police,they did not know what was going on with him,although he had a medical alert bracelet and they often helped me out when I was not strong enough to handle him.
I am however glad no policeofficer had Tasers in those days,or my son would more than likely be dead today.
There are many times I can understand why the police uses Tasers,but the case at Vancouver airport to me,was nothing short of murder,very sad:sad:

chico2
December 10th, 2007, 04:48 PM
Also,not that my youngest son would do anything illegal,but he has a pace-maker to keep his damaged heart going,would the police ask questions first and use the Taser later?,it would most certainly kill my son..

Bearsmom
December 11th, 2007, 08:21 AM
No, what I objected to was the implication that a thrill is obtained by hurting someone.

I NEVER took a "thrill" in having to hurt someone in order to get them to, oh, for example stop beating the ***** out of their spouses with a baseball bat, I was employed to enforce the laws and used whatever means worked in order to get someone to comply. It ALWAYS left me with a sick feeling when I had to use force to get them to comply. ALWAYS.

I never watched the Robert (?) video, I had it up to my ears with the violence that I myself witnessed while on the beat. Trust me, the stories I could tell would curl your toenails at best, so I choose NOT to watch things like that. I think what happened was with Robert's lack of english comprehension, and the officer's inability to translate from Polish just made the situation very ugly. From what I understand, the RCMP is going to make more effort to have more translators around, and to make a better effort to find one. It's so easy to armchair quarterback when you haven't done the job. Policing is not a nice job to do, if everyone behaved themselves, they'd be out of work, now wouldn't they.

I wasn't there, so I can't pass judgement. I just can't.

mona_b
December 11th, 2007, 11:08 AM
Tasers don't kill... it's the overzealous, trigger happy sadistic cops!

I guess the old-fashioned way of beating the snot out of someone with the nightstick isn't popular any more.

:laughing:

As a Police Officer it's comments like this that offend me.Some of you guys have no clue what we go through and the things that we see.And we hope and pray that we make it home after our shift to be with our families.

I know exactly what Bearsmom is talking about.I know those stories as I too have seen them.And still do.And when I come home from a long shift the first thing I do is hug my daughter.

We have been trained to use force "when" needed.And I will not hesitate to use what ever force I can to protect myself.

What some people have to realize is sometimes we don't have time to think in certain situations.It's a do or die situation.

My BIL was on the force for many years.He took a bullet and a knife to his body.Guess that was the time he should have beaten the snot out of the guy.

Not all cops on the Ontario forces carry tasers.I actually wanted to know what it felt like to be tasered.What a feeling.Oh,and I didn't die.:)

As for the deaths when tasered,not one coroner has said the death was from the taser.

All I can say is unless you are in a situation like that,please don't judge.

Dogastrophe
December 11th, 2007, 11:58 AM
What would be more useful to report would be to have a list of taser deaths compared to total taser usage during the same time period - are they leathal 1 in a 1000 uses, 10000 uses?

It is far to easy to sit back and say what the police should have done in a situation particularly when you can piece the story together. It is much more difficult for those on the front line who are faced with the situation.

:2cents:

chico2
December 11th, 2007, 04:45 PM
Mona,in no way am I judging the police,for every killing in Toronto by gang-members shooting each other up,I say the police must be totally fed up,totally frustrated.
In very dangerous domestic situation,they don't even know what they are getting in to,or for that matter just stopping a speeder,there are all kinds of dangers something every police-officer knows,I am sure..
But that is also part of the job they've chosen and trained for.
I am not talking about any other case than the Polish man at Vancouver airport,I cried over the way he was welcomed to Canada and over the way his mom must have felt.
He was not dangerous,no knife or gun,just a very confused,frustrated man:sad:

CearaQC
December 12th, 2007, 07:38 AM
The saddest thing I ever read about tasers, in the UK, their police have been given the OK to tase children. How long before that policy comes to North America??

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=479341&in_page_id=1770

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=479511&in_page_id=1770

Here's what's coming after tasers - microwave weapons.

http://www.truthnews.us/?p=245

A video from the DoD

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=e71_1191881043

My main point is many police officers are having burnout and stress. Same thing with the military. When times are tough, those people act out in the worst ways because they don't understand what's happening to them or how to handle the stress.

Ever since 9/11 police have had a really hard time. They hear the same stuff every day, how to look for a terrorist and what to do. It's all beat into their heads almost like a mantra, and everyone is seen as a potential terrorist. People that are solitary, or support animal welfare are some of the terrorist criteria listed on the FBI flyer.

http://www.infowars.com/Images/fbi_flyer2.jpg

Here's the guy at the John Kerry forum who was arrested for asking about the voting problems and if he was in Skull and Bones. He's heard saying, "Please don't tase me" when they already had him on the ground and in cuffs. There was a huge cop that carried him to the back of the room. How come that same large man didn't just carry the guy outside after he was in cuffs? Why did they tase him? He wasn't threatening anyone, and didn't have any weapons - except for his mind. More importantly, how were his questions grounds to treat him like that? Look at the white goofy looking guy on top of the student, smiling big. He seemed to enjoy what was going on. Time stamp 3:17

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IATPoHdpak0

Here's the guy that was on the news and requested a copy of the video to share with the public. The cop wouldn't even let him talk and behaved rudely. Another cop shows up and the first cop says he tased him and the other guy sarcastically said, "Painful isn't it?" A professional policeman would never talk like that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMaMYL_shxc

I can't tell anyone what to think but I encourage everyone to research and find out for themselves. No one needs to "be there" when there are so many good videos available. If a court will accept video as evidence, then the "I wasn't there" statement is irrelevant.

Bearsmom
December 12th, 2007, 05:20 PM
Okay, no, I wouldn't agree with tasing a child, unless he's a member of one of the many gangs who roam the streets and was pointing a loaded weapon at me....(they can't be charged if they're under the age of 10, you can thank the YOA for that one)

"the truth news" is one man's webpage, with one man's perspective on things, hardly something I'd take as "the truth"

The voiceover on the University of Florida guy video is pretty funny. If you watch closely at the beginning, he does NOT say "thank you very much". Watch carefully. Plus, I'd hardly rely on Youtube as a reliable source for anything, for pete's sake. I lost interest after about 30 seconds.

I couldn't hear anything but the officer asking for the dl and registration of the motorist, other than that, all I could hear was traffic zooming by.

I need to know if you're an expert on cop related stress. You seem to be able to find many videos that are anti-taser, and quickly blame it on job-related stress.

The police are in a highly public job with all these armchair quarterbacks sitting about telling them how to do their jobs, yet would probably wet their pants the first day they were confronted by someone, should they have the GUTS to try and do the job.

Next time you head off to work, imagine if someone was standing over you critiquing your every single move. And telling you how you could do it better and how they'd never do it THAT way. Tell me how well you'd handle it.

I'm done, obviously my 12 years working in one of the highest crime divisions couldn't possibly have prepared me for the anti-police statements I've read on here.