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culling

chico2
May 6th, 2004, 08:15 AM
Well,our brilliant government has decided to give a death-sentence to 6.000 Cormorants in Presqu'il Prov.Park,near Belleville Ont.
It's going to be done as a free-for-all for anyone with a gun,before hatchlings are born.
Environmentalists,Naturalists and Animal protection people lost the fight to save the birds.
It just angers me how we,the"superior"humane race,decide culling of any species when there seem to be too many,how many are too many?
Who's next on their list? Swans?Ducks? etc...

kasher+tazz
May 6th, 2004, 08:33 AM
Too many greedy people is the problem not too many animals...sick

Luba
May 6th, 2004, 09:30 AM
WHAT is Ducks Unlimited doing about this?

I never heard about that , how horrid!

cmt489
May 6th, 2004, 11:13 AM
Luba,

Sadly, Ducks Unlimited may be supporting this. What many people do not realize about Ducks Unlimited is that it is a "conservation" group set up by hunters to ensure there are enough ducks to hunt in the fall. :( I sincerely doubt they will have a problem with a free for all hunt.

In northern BC, many of the sights maintained by Ducks Unlimited are littered with shot gun shells from hunters in the fall. It is really quite sad...

Michelle

amaruq
May 6th, 2004, 11:43 AM
Are they going to shoot the eggs?This is disgusting.

The pellets used to be made out of lead shot. When the ducks would dive and pick up debris they would get poisoned by the shot. Laws have changed that lead shot is not allowed but some fools still used it.

Ducks unlimited was suppose to help the ducks but seems tides have turned and seem to support the hunters instead.

chico2
May 6th, 2004, 03:30 PM
Ducks Unlimited,is just that,unlimited ducks for hunters :mad:
I was talking to one of the naturalists involved in trying to save the Cormorants and he said:This is the most depressing day in my life!
He was absolutely despondent.But he also said,the fight is not over,the next victims are the Mute Swans,apparently they are eating too much vegetation.
It just makes me sick in my heart,it's evil :mad:
Amaruq,they are not shooting the eggs,6.000 birds will be shot and the eggs destroyed.

amaruq
May 6th, 2004, 03:55 PM
Thats' just sick!!!!!! I hope they can stop this!

chico2
May 6th, 2004, 04:24 PM
No Amaruq,they could not stop it,our government decided to let the hunters go on a killing-spree.I am not sure about the Mute Swan it's still being debated.

melanie
May 6th, 2004, 05:06 PM
and what really sucks, is that it is humans that create the conditions for species to become over populated in the first place and then go and kill them when there is a problem like to many birds pooing on their nice cars when they are out and about. such causes of over population at the hands of man include- hunting predatory species, building large rubbish dumps and crappy undrained swamp lands (results of over development) and then carry on that there is a population crisis, it just sucks. poor birds. they do that with the koalas you know, they get a little to frisky and have too many babys and what do you know, boom, pop crisis shoot the little things (esp in urban areas).
and what would any one want with a dead duck anyway, it would be gamey meat, you could buy a better one that was farm grown and taste better?? idiots :(

Luba
May 6th, 2004, 05:48 PM
I realise what DU does but I wouldn't think they would actually support something like this. What a travesty!

I' m taken aback by how horrid we are as people!

chico2
May 6th, 2004, 08:16 PM
Yes Luba,it's an unending story.. :(
Melanie,you are right,a few years back due to pollution and such,there was only one Cormorant nest in the park,so they were reintroduced and now they are too many(for us humans)hence the killing of 6.000 birds and they are quiet large birds.There is something very wrong in the way we rule over lesser creatures(I wonder who is lesser?)decide who gets killed and who lives at our whim. It's sad... :(

Luba
May 6th, 2004, 08:54 PM
This sounds like a repeat of the Canada Goose situation.

Karin
May 6th, 2004, 10:18 PM
Last year our Muted Swan Martha was killed during the second nesting season for the pair.
George, her mate still builds and nests every season...I called around trying to find info on Muted Swans...they do mate for life...but George may take another female as a companion or even mate since he is young..
Last year we saw an article about the nusience Muted swans being killed do to "over run" of the species...we contacted the powers to be and offered any payment needed, ( I had an aircraft ready to move and retrieve asap), we were told it was "Illegal to transport the Swans across state lines."

So..I see it is okay to kill them but not transport them...HUH!!!


This was the State of Maryland..and Michigan has followed.. why do they have to die?

chico2
May 6th, 2004, 10:33 PM
Karin,I am not sure what has been done yet,but I know people thought the Muted Swan ate all the under-water vegetation,so they were going to cull them and replace them with Trumpeter Swans,in their view not as destructive.I even think it was somewhere on the US/Canada border.
I will find out what has been decided,from Barry,who told me about it in the first place.
I am sorry for your Swan,I hope he finds another mate,is there more Muted Swans in your area,or is he the only one?

Luba
May 6th, 2004, 10:37 PM
I'm surprised a media hasn't jumped all over this!

I wonder if it would do any good to let them know?? What do you think?

chico2
May 6th, 2004, 10:52 PM
Luba,they have known all along.The story about the Cormorants has been in the newspaper several times.Today,in the Star they told about the governments desicion,even though several groups protested the killing of the 6.000 Cormorants.
I do have the article Barry wrote about the culling of the Swans,I'll try to find it tomorrow and post if I know how :p

woodbyter
May 7th, 2004, 06:04 AM
The muted swan and others would do just fine if man were not in the picture. Nature has a natural cycle of selection and survival. It worked in harmony for millions of years, then along came man. I have heard it said that alligators are the longest surviving, most efficient killing machine in the world. That may be so for longivity but as for being the most efficient killing machine-Man takes the prize. How dumb is it to kill a few surviving animals because we don't like what they eat??ot to change the direction of the thread but until man gets smart enough to live in harmony with nature we will not even show up, in the future, as a blip on the radar screen of nature's history. Anything dumb enough to kill innocent animals or animals that don't fit what we consider to be a useful mold-but at the same time allows molesters and killers of our our species to get a slap on the wrist and go on their merry way- is not smart enough to survive too long. I'm not Chicken Little - but the sky is falling folks!!!!
Glad I live where there aren't too many humans :mad: .

chico2
May 7th, 2004, 07:14 AM
Here is the story about the Muted Swans situation.I am waiting to get an up-date,to see what ultimately happened to them.
Woodie,I sooo agree with you!!!!
I hope this works :confused:
http://www.nowtoronto.com/issues/2003-09-04/news_story3php
Well,It did'nt work,I'll try to find another way,sorry about that!!!

chico2
May 7th, 2004, 07:39 AM
I guess I am just not savvy enough :mad: the article was called"Shoot them all!"by BarryMcKay.

Luba
May 7th, 2004, 07:40 AM
Tx Anita I suppose I never read the paper = therefore never know.
So much crap in the news you can never filter to the important stuff.

I was going to fwd to Bob Hunter but I suppose then he knows already about it :(

chico2
May 7th, 2004, 08:02 AM
Luba,I believe Barry and Bob Hunter have been involved in projects together.
The fight is over for the Cormorants,the BIG boss the government,has decided,the Cormorants lost :mad:

Luba
May 7th, 2004, 08:54 AM
So who wants to make bets on how may hunters get shot during this fury of killing? Any takers?

And what the heck are they gonna do with them when they kill them?

chico2
May 7th, 2004, 04:00 PM
Karin,I just found out the culling of the Mute Swans were supposed to have happend in Chesepeak Bay,US,but got stopped on legal grounds.However
there is move going on now,to have the law changed and remove the protection for the Mute Swan in the US.

Luba
May 7th, 2004, 04:42 PM
Okay from what I've read the culling is going to be done by Ministry staff only now. (not that it makes it any better)

TVO did a documentary on it today, only got part of it but the rationale around the non-culling community indicates these birds are eating fish which wash up on shore dead and stink anyway.

Logical approch, leave the birds they eat the stinky dead fish,
If you get rid of the birds you have to spend money cleaning up the
beaches for tourists from all the carcass?
Oui/non?

melanie
May 10th, 2004, 05:02 PM
what totally freaks me out is that we are playing with evolution and genetic diversity.
evolution-ok comerants disapeared due to polution, there was a breeding pair left. if the breeding pair were protected and their habitiat improved (oh that needs to be done by humans-yeah right) the birds may have made it and started breeding, this would eventually lead to genetic changes that would make the comerants tougher or able to cope in the specific environment (hopefully, well that is how the theory works). but they repopulated the area, this means they have either breed the comerants for repopulation, which involves genetic selection by humans, or they have removed comerants from other areas and introduced them, stupid mistake-introduce disease, forced genetic selection ect.
genetic diversity-choosing breeding pairs is not a good idea, let them choose as they will get it right obviously. pairs are choosen for different reasons, and eventually if you have several pairs (say 4-5) in captivity their is a chance that down the track birds will be interbreeding and result in a screwed up population if not done extrememly carefully..and it hardly ever works well...
if they just improved habitat for the sp and protected it, it would be a whole lot cheaper and easier, nicer, more ethical and simply a responsibility of humans, we stuffed it in the first place.
ahhhhh. soon we will have comerants with 2 heads, frogs that speak spanish and koalas that eat humans yay. it is hard to accept that humans do this sort of rubbuish, i just dont understand how others cant feel empathetic and protective of these creatures. i am a strict vegetarian and am always telling my husband and sister that one day thsoe cows and sheep may just turn on us and start eating humans, and i will become queen of the BOVINE, horrah :p :D :D .

Luba
May 10th, 2004, 06:41 PM
But you know Mel they always look for the quick fixes to shut up whoever is complaining the loudest and for whatever reason. Hardly do the powers that be look towards long term solutions or goals. They may say they do but money talks!