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Frustrated with my vet...again

March 16th, 2007, 09:37 PM
I know I should just switch vets instead of coming here and complaining about him but it's in the cards and I'll be searching for a new vet soon so I can stop doing this.

The reason for the complaint is that today we had to bring Moxy to the vet because we thought she had a bladder infection due to her sudden urinating in the house. So we called and got in today and our suspicions were confirmed, she has some crystals forming in her bladder and she's been put on an antibiotic and special food. He brings out the food and out of curiousity I looked at the ingredients and I turned to my girlfriend and gave her a look of disgust...Rice, Ground Corn, something, Corn Gluten Meal...first four ingredients. It's Royal Canin pH balancing food I do believe. I asked the vet if there was a different brand of this type of food we could feed her. Of course he asks why and I tell him I'm not too thrilled about the amount of corn in it. This prompted him to go into a big schpeel (most directed at my girlfriend because I stopped listening) in which he asked her if she ate corn (YES) and is she dead (NO) so it's not bad for a dog to eat it. Then he added that she's not allergic to it so as long as the dog isn't it's fine. He also said something about the ingredients and how they're not specifically in the amounts according to the order they're listed on the bag. Grains are good for dogs, studies have been done, yadda yadda yadda...we both left feeling really insulted by him. He basically said that other than the really really low end brands, that any dog food is going to be alright for your dog unless of course it's having an allergic reaction.

So after that long winded explanation we asked if the dog food is the reason for her crystals and the answer was why are we switching foods? I don't know much about this condition so I could be wrong but if the food isn't the cause then why switch? Also, we had to ask the vet assistant how to give her the antibiotics and she gave us a very crappy explanation. Just another unsatisfactory visit to our vet, which also killed our wallet. :yell:

March 16th, 2007, 09:45 PM
So sorry Moxy is not feeling well. Get better soon Moxy.
Too bad about how you feel about the vet. I hope your search for a new one is a success.

March 16th, 2007, 10:01 PM
Aww, it sucks when you aren't listened to. :frustrated:

I'm not sure, but I think it's too much magnesium or something that causes the crystals... Maybe calcium? Maybe too many minerals period? :shrug:

March 16th, 2007, 10:49 PM
He said it's not her food though, so where else could the symptoms come from?

Ohh...I just had a brain fart....I let her lick out my empty yogurt container and I've given her some apple pieces over the past few weeks, could that be the cause?

I'll feel awful if that could be the reason.

March 16th, 2007, 11:00 PM
no, stones take a while to form. Boo had some a while ago and they haven't come back yet. It could be diet (too many minerals, depending on the type of stone) or it can also be genetic.. :shrug:

March 16th, 2007, 11:15 PM
Tommy was diagnosed with crystals back around Christmas, and the vet had mentioned something about putting him on special food. His tummy issues were more important though and we never did... the crystals went away with the antibiotics and so far they haven't come back :fingerscr . When he started getting better with his tummy I asked about it, and the vet said that since it was the first time he's had them then as long as he is doing fine right now, there's no need to have special food. I think there are certain mineral concentrations in some foods that can make it easier for crystals to form, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they WILL form. Some doggies are just more predisposed to it than others and their bodies will use those ingredients the wrong way. I agree with you that the food is lousy, I would only consider switching Tommy to it if it becomes a consistent problem.

March 16th, 2007, 11:42 PM
I am sorry for the fustration...some vets just don't listen and then they hire staff just like them.

I did a goolge search for "cause of urinary crystals in dogs" and got a ton of websites that help explain it. A lot mentioned uti as the most common reason for struvite crystals. I'd put a link but there was just soo many.

I have heard that food, treats can affect the ph level as well (ph to high one type of crystals and to low another type of crystals can form). Since Moxy did have an infection I would think that would be the reason for the crystals and perhaps not the food. If there was no infection then maybe the food/treats etc...

I'd google to learn more and then for sure a new vet and when you go to your new vet even if it's just for a regular check up ask about the urine/ph/crystals etc... and see what he/she says. If they don't seem to know or aren't really interested in answering then you will have an idea of what kind of vet they are for when you really need them (make sure to have the old records faxed to the new vet so they'll have a medical history).

Good luck and I hope Moxy feels better soon and you find a vet how is interested in the client and their pet(one who is happy to share their knowlege and educate, not one who just tells you what to do/think because "that's the way it is" one who talks to you not at you).

March 17th, 2007, 12:32 AM
Sorry to hear about Moxy. :grouphug: I would also look for a different vet. It makes alot of difference when you find one that you are comfortable with.

March 17th, 2007, 01:56 AM
I'm not an expert on cat food, far from it, but I suggest you give canned food as part or all of her diet; the extra liquid will help prevent crystals from forming again. I think some cats are more susceptible than others and the food is just one element in avoiding a repeat, but the more liquid she gets, the better.

March 17th, 2007, 02:08 AM
I've also heard that with cats but Moxy is a dog. :)

March 17th, 2007, 07:21 AM
Urinary infections/crytals are definitely related to urinary pH (which is affected by the food, at least that what my vet told me)). As well, when Angus had his infection/crystals, I looked at the phosphorous and magnesium content of the food I had him on, as well as the ash content (which I beleive is phosphorous and magnesium) and compared it to the prescription food then I looked for a food that had similar levels of those minerals in it as well as any other ingredients that would be beneficial to the urinary tract, such as cranberries. I think after the infection is gone, keeping the pH at a good level is key.

March 17th, 2007, 07:27 AM
If you go in again about this then you need to arm yourself with tons of info on why the ingredients are bad, give the vet a good argument. Let him know that you know what you're talking about, after all Moxy is your pet and ultimately you decide what goes into her body not the vet.

March 17th, 2007, 12:47 PM
That's the plan, we go back in three weeks and we're going to have some info ready. We thought about bringing the food back and just using the antibiotics but haven't decided yet. I'll be sure to compare the foods and see what differences there are in it.

Thanks for all the input everyone! :)

March 17th, 2007, 12:51 PM
Good luck and please keep us updated. :fingerscr Hugs for Moxy. :grouphug:

March 17th, 2007, 02:48 PM
This prompted him to go into a big schpeel (most directed at my girlfriend because I stopped listening) in which he asked her if she ate corn (YES) and is she dead (NO) so it's not bad for a dog to eat it

I eat chocolate, grapes and all kinds of other stuff that can be toxic to dogs, and I'm not dead. :rolleyes:
I should start feeding my dogs a bowl of chocolate ice cream with their meals. Dairy and chocolate didn't kill me, so it MUST be good for my dogs.

With that kind of logic I can see why you'd be frustrated with your vet.
My vet just kind of ignores us when we talk about food, they know better than to argue, but they can't say their food is bad because they sell it, lol.

March 17th, 2007, 04:32 PM
Not the answer you want, but several years ago my dog had bladder stones and a few crystals. He had the stones surgically removed and then had to eat the Hill's canned "stone/crystals" food for several months at which point he was X-Rayed to determine if further crystals had developed. To my everlasting relief, he was clear. Dachshunds are gourmets, so this was not a pleasant period for us. But, had he developed additional crystals, he would have been on this food for life. I personally suffer from acid based kidney stones which makes life the devil - really have to watch purines and oxalic acid. I suggest you use the food you bought - or get the appropriate Hill's for the type of problem your pup has and give it a try. You have nothing to lose - and perhaps your story might have a happy ending. We now have an American Eskimo - and this breed is prone to stones. He will turn 3 April 1 - so far so good - to best of my knowledge. But should he start peeing blood, well Hill's it will be - not good for an Eskie though, since they do best on fish based diets and corn does tend to go through them. But stones are a lot worse as I well know.

March 18th, 2007, 12:48 PM
I eat chocolate, grapes and all kinds of other stuff that can be toxic to dogs, and I'm not dead. :rolleyes:
I should start feeding my dogs a bowl of chocolate ice cream with their meals. Dairy and chocolate didn't kill me, so it MUST be good for my dogs.

Very well put...I plan on using that line on our return visit to the vet.

Anyone have a tip on getting these pills down my dogs throat, she's tricky, makes me think the pill is gone and then I turn around and it's on the floor. :frustrated:

March 18th, 2007, 01:09 PM
Hold the head up vertically, massage the throat gently and wait for a few swallows...:o

jesse's mommy
March 18th, 2007, 01:21 PM
Anytime we have to give Jesse pills we hide it in cheese. :o

March 18th, 2007, 02:31 PM
With Declan, I hide pills in peanut butter or a spoonful of canned tripe. Luckily with the girls I can practically shove my whole arm down their throats so dosing them has never been a problem.

Ceili went through a period a few years ago where it seemed like every other week she had a UTI and was on antibiotics. I found using mega-cranberry pills was ultimately the cure for her problem.

March 18th, 2007, 02:39 PM
Usually the hide it in food trick works. If not, and Prin's way doesn't work, try putting the pill as far back in her mouth as you can, hold he mouth closed with one hand and rub the top of her nose/snout.

Some dogs have a different way of reacting to the way pills are given. Good luck. :fingerscr