Pets.ca - Pet forum for dogs cats and humans 

-->

how long did it take you to make the switch...

billyp
February 16th, 2007, 02:18 PM
how long did it take you to make the switch from kibble to RAw...it's been 2 days I'm feeding my 2 boxers turkey drumstick, thighs and back and since then they have the most horrible diarrea ever.
I gave em some yogurt today and smaller portion of turkey...maybe i shouldn't have switched cold turkey (lol) but gradually mixed the raw meat with some dry food?
any advice?

technodoll
February 16th, 2007, 02:24 PM
well turkey bones are thicker and harder to digest than chicken bones... it is recommended to first start with chicken and gooo slooowly... specially if your dog has a sensitive tummy (some can switch in an instant and never have soft poo)

OK so fast your dog for a day (half a day for puppies), and then only give soft chicken parts (bone-in, no skin) with a healthy dose of digestive enzymes for the first few days. don't feed too much, that will also give wet poops. think "purity and simplicity". try feeding the chicken semi-frozen to encourage your dogs to really chew well and prep their tummies with the digestive juices they need to break down this "new food".

unless your dogs are allergic to chicken, you will see nice poops soon. if they are drinking and eating normally, good energy, then no worries it's just a transition.

how much do your dogs weigh, how old are they, and how much turkey have you given them (per day) so far? was that with skin? with a bit more info we can help you reach that "magic balance" :goodvibes:

PS: my raw-fed boy got into a LITTLE bit of kibble at the dogsitter's last night, and this morning he had the most horrible diarrhea! UUGHH! so you see... it can go both ways, LOL!

billyp
February 16th, 2007, 02:38 PM
well I bought turkey because Taika (female boxer 16 mths old 55pd) does not well with chicken.
I'm feeding both about the same amount 400-450grms per serving 2X a day.
(btw ranger is a boxer 4 mths old 30pds) .
As for energy and drinking everything seems to be fine. They are like they use to be only that they seem to have an hose connected you know where :mad:
I make sure I remove most of the skin but there is always a bit remaining...
Thanks again :)

technodoll
February 16th, 2007, 03:03 PM
hmmm was the chicken that caused problems in the past served raw? cooked chicken, or chicken in kibble-form often causes issues that raw chicken does not... just a thought :)

if you can pick up some Urban Carnivore raw patties (pure meat & bone, see http://www.urbancarnivore.com/uc_online/pages.cfm?ID=25, sold in many quality petshops in montreal) and feed that for the first week, coupled with a broad-spectrum digestive enzyme and probiotics, i'm sure that will ease the transition to raw. bones are ground up so easier to digest, feed frozen for a chewing workout... then slowly start adding whole meat pieces, then some bone-in pieces, until you don't need to feed pre-made patties anymore.

there are dozens of ways to cope with the "first day tummy upsets", you need to figure out what is best for you. do not feed any more kibble, this stresses their already struggling system, let their bodies focus on acclimatizing to the raw without dealing with the hard kibble digestion.

have you been to the raw-feeding boxer forum yet? :)

billyp
February 16th, 2007, 03:34 PM
i believe you are right with the chicken issue it is only in kibble that she has had some...with desastrous results :yuck:
I should give the chicken a try but
i was also wondering if it's already been 2-3 days with the turkey (and the fact that I got 50 more pds of turkey in the freezer hehe) shouldn't I continue until they do fine on it or I must absolutely switch to chicken first?The store I go to carries some of them patties you'Re talking about but I thought it would be easier to buy my own meat in bulk (and less expensive)
But if it helps I might go buy some tomorrow...thanks

technodoll
February 16th, 2007, 03:45 PM
by all means, continue with the turkey :) some start on beef, or fish, or pork... doesn't *have* to be chicken. but i would watch out for those thicker bones though... ever since the time my boy pooped big sharp pieces of turkey wing bone (i had a bag and picked up the bloody diarrhea and felt the bones, they were still so hard!) well since then, i'm a bit leary of turkey bones that are not part of the ribcage or the neck... but that's just me. others feed entire turkeys with no issues at all. ;)

i strongly suggest you go to the pharmacy and ask for a full-spectrum digestive enzyme (they're not expensive) and give some to your dogs before each meal, normally one or two caplets. it can help them break down the new food. some dogs are lactose-intolerant so adding yogurt is not always a good idea.

for the chicken, i'd hold off until poops are stabilized, then introduce it down the road as a new protein source. if the runs happen after a chicken meal then yes, could very well be a chicken intolerance no matter the form.

please keep us posted! :dog:

billyp
February 16th, 2007, 03:58 PM
ill sure try the enzyme...
I give them yogurt since I know taika has no problem with it and one day or the other I have to know whether Ranger is intolerant or not ;)
I'll stick with the turkey i have never seen any bone or anything like that in their ''stools'' so I think they are dealing fine with them...
I'mhoping that within a week everything will be ok...I'm not planning on dealing with diarrea for much longer then that :fingerscr

Scott_B
February 16th, 2007, 06:31 PM
If you havent already, try removing the skin from the turkey.

billyp
February 17th, 2007, 10:37 AM
I had to wake up 6 times last night for Ranger and 4 times for Taika. They were asking me for the door and the diarrea was undescribable...:(
this morning Ranger had a bit a blood in his stools probably due to the number of times he had to go potty...
I would have loved to make to switch but I just feel like I'm harming them with this constant diarrea...Thanks for your advices anyway :)

technodoll
February 17th, 2007, 12:35 PM
awe that's too bad. but really, if you give up after only 3 days you're not doing your dogs any favors :o YES sometimes it can be rough to switch. Maybe they're allergic to turkey. what if they caught a bug that is totally unrelated to raw? what if the turkey you bought has additives or wasn't stored properly?

really if you follow our advice... it can go VERY well. there are more dogs having terrible diarrhea with kibble switches than with raw switches (case in point, my dog got into a few mouthfuls of kibble the other day at my dogsitters and he had explosive diarrhea too, blood coming out of his butt from all the cramping. But I know s**t happens (literally, LOL!) and so what? you fast for a day, give some immodium, then feed a small simple meal with digestive enzymes and probiotics, and then all is back to normal :shrug:

i really would encourage you to get some of those raw patties as per below, and be patient. nature has a way of working things out ;)

angeldogs
February 17th, 2007, 05:19 PM
that's to bad switching back to kibble.we started switching our boy's.it's been 7 days now.jag just started get paste poops.and ben had the runs or a few days.now he's starting to get better.i won't switch back i'm hooked and so are the dogs.they are still on kibble also.i also start off with small amounts of raw and slowly increasing the amount and that seems to be helping alot.

technodoll
February 17th, 2007, 06:06 PM
hey angeldogs, would be cool to see some "before raw" photos and later "after raw", you will see a change in coat, physique, etc and it's fun to see the changes :)

billyp
February 17th, 2007, 09:21 PM
technodoll I believe you and I know switching to raw would be the best for my dogs but it's been 4 days and I know it's not very long but it has only gotten worst...
Like you said it might be the turkey that wasnt stored properly but I have a very hard time watching my dogs dealing with diarrea ( I lost a dog once who had diarrea issues and I now flip everytime one of my dog get soft stools so u can imagine my reaction when BOTH get diarrea :S)
So I think I'll stick to high quality kibble and the occasional marrow bone sardine and eggs ...that's the way I fed Taika all her life and she does wonderful that way...:sad:

technodoll
February 17th, 2007, 09:24 PM
billyp i'm so sorry your kids are having such a hard time :sad: i hope they get better soon :grouphug: if ever you want to try again, when the dogs are having easy tummies, maybe you could try another way (not turkey) and ask here what would be the best steps to avoid cannon butts :p

you just reminded me i need to buy sardines for the kids, they haven't had any for a about a month. ooops! :dog:

billyp
February 17th, 2007, 09:29 PM
lol @ the sardines...:dog:
well that wouldnt be a bad idea I think I'm gonna wait until both are fine and will try switching again but with chicken this time...like you said it might be easier for them digesting chicken then rather than turkey...
Now I have 50 pds of turkey to get rid of...hehehe

technodoll
February 18th, 2007, 12:29 AM
he he he... turkey soup, turkey meatloaf, turkey sandwiches, turkey schnitzels, turkey-in-the-trash-bin! :D just kidding. it can keep for a year in the freezer if it's for the dogs :thumbs up

angeldogs
February 18th, 2007, 10:51 AM
billyp sorry they still have the squirts and havent gotten over it.we had them lastnight with ben.gave him less then a half an oz of beef heart.hope trying with the chicken will work.

Ok TD i will use some of the pictures before and take some new ones with only 1 meal o raw.and i do see a difference.