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I think that I need some help – small puppy, big attitude

Violeta
October 10th, 2006, 03:13 PM
I am the only one that really disciplines and teaches the dog in my house. My parents in law completely spoil her and baby her every time she is in their site so she is obviously extremely happy to see them (unlike to see me …:sad: ). They take her in their arms and on their lap on the bed, let her do what she wants, I’ve seen them plain tug-war (sp?) with her and wrestling and then when she starts biting they scream at her “NO BITING” but then laugh and continue babying her ?!!!!

I told them not to and their answer was “haw can you not, she is so cute” :eek: .

Because I am the only one that disciplines her she obviously is more happy to be or see them and is starting to retaliate when I tell her no to bite; last night she was really biting my foot and I told her NO, didn’t listen so I pushed her away gently, she came back and bit me again, then I pushed her again and at this time she growled at me (not in play, it was a very stand offish, serious growl ! :mad: ) and then bit me on the hand, I tried to take her by the scruff and then completely went ballistic on me, tried to take her nicely (I was thinking that maybe it was hurting her but it didn’t help) I have puncture wounds on my fingers and scratches all over my hands :sick: .

If I hand feed her something, she knows to lick and be gentle but all the other time she tries to bite, very, very mouthy. Also, this may count, she is not submissive at all, would not stay on her back unless you scratch her belli. When she meets new people she greets them very happily (kind of hyper actually) and submissive so this is a little confusing to me.

I am very convinced that it was aggression and not play because it’s the same pattern that I’ve seen with her brothers, they would jump on her and bite her and then she would start to fight back really aggressively because that was the only way she was able to fight them off.

What to do now? I have never had a dog that bit me before; I do understand that she is a puppy but that was no puppy play! And I am not willing to let her be this way.

I made this very clear to the breeder that I need a puppy that is gentle and not aggressive and this is what I still want – I can not have her going to see sick children and old people with this attitude :sad: .

Any advice?

dakar
October 10th, 2006, 04:07 PM
How old is your baby now? Not old if I remember. Biting is a puppy thing but if you're concerned about agression I would suggest puppy classes and consulting a trainer in your area. From my experience pup's will try to challenge you from time to time, just like kids do. Stay firm and it should get better. Pushing her away, gently or not, may not be your best choice for discipline. Have you tried ignoring her, turning your back on her, even leaving the room? My youngest pup was very mouthy and it took a long time to get her to settle down. Consistancy is the key. Maybe your inlaws will listen to a trainer if they are unwilling to listen to you. I'm sure others here will have lots of good advice. Good luck!

SnowDancer
October 10th, 2006, 04:33 PM
I think you need to have obedience training classes - perhaps private to deal with your pup's specific issues. I think you might have an Alpha or an Alpha Want-To-Be in the making. I have had both (mini Dachshunds all) - fortunately my Super Alphas were benevolent, particularly with me, but the Want-To-Be Alpha Dachshund caused problems. We now have an Eskimo, adopted at 13 weeks - he also came from a litter where he was the one beaten up by his siblings and is somewhat insecure as a result, but he is definitely not Alpha or even Want-To-Be. Certainly we had the puppy nibbling - and the word "Ouch" is only in his vocabularly when it applies to him. His teeth are larger than normal - then and now at 2 1/2 years of age, but except for grazing of our skin, he never actually bit us causing a puncture. When we picked him up, the "breeders" tried to encourage us to take his brother - not a chance - I recognized the look in that dog's eyes as he tried to stop our pup from getting to us. Hopefully whoever adopted that little fellow was able to get him under control. Even though our Eskie is 22 lbs. and physically much bigger than the 10 lb. Dachshunds, he seems smaller.

pug lover
October 10th, 2006, 04:46 PM
i would have to recommend obedience training for all 3 of you, it cant hurt the puppy and all the people involved with this puppy would learn how to react to its mouthy behaviors and all involved would be correcting the pup in the same fashion

good luck with your pup and keep us up to date:thumbs up

Violeta
October 10th, 2006, 05:10 PM
She is only 9 weeks and this is why I was a little concerned. She is such a perfect dog otherwise, stays close to me when we take walks, completely potty and crate trained, comes when called etc. I hope that I am not blowing this out of proportions but I never had to deal with a pup like this.

Let’s say that it was just play, this is still unacceptable. How do I make this young pup understand that I am the alpha and that growling or biting me is not acceptable?

Obedience is coming but not until all her shots are done so I have a few more weeks and I have to corrected now not after weeks or months of letting her do whatever. :frustrated:

Angies Man
October 10th, 2006, 06:32 PM
It's not play, it's not appropriate, and if you let it go, you'll have real problems later.

At nine weeks, she's still a bit young to be away from her mom and littermates, it's an important socialization time for puppies and I've read that dogs that don't get enough time with their doggy family tend to be mouthy (tend to snap and bite.)

With your parents, when she bites or gets mouthy, you should end her part of the visit and put her in her crate in another room. (time out) Yelling 'no biting' and then continuing the cuddling and play only encourages more biting.

In fact, "no biting" is more of a command than she needs. A loud, assertive "NO!" will get her to stop whatever she's doing immediately. If she tries to bite, yell NO and immediately put her in her crate for a few minutes to allow her a time out. Then bring her out and continue with whatever you were doing, she doesn't understand long period punishment or anger, so it serves no purpose. And any sort of physical punishment, even a slap, serves no purpose--you can get her to submit with the force of your voice.

Reward her with "Gooood Girrrl" in a higher pitched than normal voice when she's being good, and be very careful to not reward her when she's not--just NO! to end the behavior and a timeout if necessary.

At 9 weeks, she's still too young for obedience class, too. You can teach her stuff, but she probably hasn't had all her shots--so contact with large groups of dogs is a no-no. But also, the brain wiring isn't ready for learning the obedience class stuff.

Changing her behavior and tendencies isn't something that will happen overnight, at this point in her young life, the best you can do is shape her personality by rewarding the good girl and minimally ignoring (with NO! and timeouts) the bad.

jessi76
October 10th, 2006, 06:32 PM
9 weeks?! she's a BABY! your lack of patience and understanding is what is unacceptable... IMO. she's NINE WEEKS OLD... she hasn't learned "aggression".

When your pup bites, try to yell OUCH! be VERY high pitched. as another littermate would "squeel". if that doesn't do it (sometimes pups just get rambunctious)... GENTLY scoop her up, PLACE her in the crate, close door calmly, and walk away for 2-5 minutes MAX. the key here is to NOT SAY A WORD. say absolutely nothing. don't act angry either - just be "matter of fact" about it. this is a time out using the crate, but by not yelling/being angry, you won't make her crate a "negative" place. it's simply for her to learn biting = time out. let her out when she is NOT whining or crying. (which may only be for a split second, so be ready)

I'm sorry, but it seems as though you may not have the patience for a puppy. this is only the beginning... pups go through many stages... whacky puppies turn into even whackier "rebellious teens" before they calm down. Be prepared for this pup to test you for quite some time.

this is why obedience class is so important, it teaches you how to deal with TYPICAL puppy behavior, and how to reinforce or correct certain behaviors properly.

keep in mind this pup is 9 wks old... redirect her to appropriate chew toys, praise and/or treat when you see her using a toy (and NOT biting you), and try the "time out" method.

be gentle, patient and calm.

technodoll
October 10th, 2006, 06:39 PM
this may help... from http://www.canismajor.com/dog/bite2.html

good luck! :angel:

Q: My Dalmatian puppy is almost nine weeks old. I got him when he was five weeks. He's playful and fun but I can't get him to stop biting me. That seems to be the only way he likes to play anymore — rough! I've been telling him No!, holding his mouth shut while saying “No bite!” and even shoving my hand back in his mouth like a trainer told me to do. Nothing seems to work. In fact, he thinks I'm playing a game with him and gets more excited the more I try to stop him. Sometimes he walks right up and attacks me! What can I do? Is he vicious?

A: No, he's not vicious, he's just being a normal, rambunctious, and sometimes obnoxious puppy. To get control of your pup's biting, it helps to understand why puppies bite in the first place.

Biting and mouthing are normal behaviors for puppies. Dogs don't have hands so they investigate objects and their environment with their mouths. To a curious puppy, everything about this big world is brand new and exciting. He learns as he goes along. You can almost hear his thought processes as he discovers something he's never seen before: "Hmmm...what's this? [chomping on it] Something to eat? No? [tossing it around] Can I play with it? Maybe. Can I make it squeak?"

Playing is also a normal learning behavior for puppies, especially play-fighting. Play-fighting with littermates and other animals develops reflexes, coordination and physical skill. It also helps them develop social skills and teaches them how to interact positively within their canine society, their "pack." And it's great fun for them. Sometimes their fighting and "attacks" on us appear frighteningly fierce but to them, it's just a game. Much like a group of kids playing make-believe games and pretending to be grown-ups, puppies have their own games and pretend to be "grown-ups," too!

A dog's ability to control the force of his biting is called "bite inhibition." It's a critically important skill that every puppy needs to learn, the earlier the better. At first, they don't know their own strength nor how sharp their little teeth really are. Puppies learn to control the force of their biting from the reactions of their mothers and littermates during play and especially play-fighting.

We can teach puppies about bite inhibition, too, but some of the methods most often recommended aren't effective. Mother dogs' methods, however, are very effective, often more so than ours. I believe this is because they're speaking to their pups in the language they understand best -- dog language! A baby puppy is much too busy learning how to be a dog to take time to understand our human words and ways. That takes time and maturity. Puppies respond to dog language in a very powerful, instinctive way. We can take advantage of that by copying a mother dog's actions and using them for ourselves.

The idea of using mother dog's natural training techniques isn't new. Respected trainers like Carol Lea Benjamin have been using them for years. To understand these methods, let's take a look at a typical mother dog disciplining her brood. We'll use my Heather (Chow) and her four rowdy puppies as an example.

When a playful puppy bites Heather hard enough to hurt, she squeals in shocked indignation. The puppy, surprised at her reaction, usually hesitates a moment, unsure of himself, then tries to bite again. Heather yelps even louder this time and whirls on the puppy, growling, showing her teeth and scowling at him fiercely. Then she turns her back on him and storms away, completely ignoring him and any further attempts to get her to play. A smart puppy picks up her clear message quickly: "if you can't play nice, I won't play with you at all!"

If the puppy persists or doesn't take the hint, Heather doesn't fool around. With a menacing growl and using her teeth, she grabs him by the scruff of his neck and gives him a shake. If he sasses back, she gives him another little shake, tougher this time. She doesn't let go of the pup till he's acknowledged her authority (in dog language) by relaxing his body, laying his ears back and keeping still for a moment. Heather disciplines especially obnoxious puppies by knocking them over with her paw and pinning them to the ground, growling angrily and pinching them with her teeth. The puppies shriek but they're not really hurt. She doesn't let them up again untill they relax and lie still. After the correction, the puppy shakes his fur back into place and goes off in search of a playmate with a better sense of humor.

We don't have to growl at our puppies or shake them with our teeth, but we can modify Heather's technique for ourselves. The next time your puppy bites you, scream "OW!" in a high-pitched voice. Exaggerate a little. Then refuse to play with him or pay attention to him for a few minutes. If he doesn't get the message, give him a little scruff shake and scold him in a low-toned, threatening voice. You can exaggerate a little on that, too! Sound meaner than you really are. For puppies that just won't quit or seem to get wilder with every correction, flip them over on their backs, scold them in that same low, scary voice (growling) and gently but firmly, hold them in that position until they stop struggling.

We sometimes give puppies the wrong message about biting by some of the games we play with them. Wrestling and tug of war can encourage a puppy to bite and make it hard for him to distinguish when it's okay to use his teeth and when it's not. To make it easier for your puppy to learn good manners, it's a good idea to avoid these games.

Puppies seem to learn a great deal about bite inhibition and authority between five and eight weeks of age through play with their mothers and littermates. This is an especially good reason not to buy very young puppies. Puppies that were acquired earlier need to be taught these important things by their owners. They might require a little more intense use of Heather's methods than puppies that stayed with their litters longer. Puppies that receive little or no training in bite inhibition, either from their mothers or their people, may grow up to develop behavior problems.

I noticed that Heather picked out certain puppies for a little "extra" correction two or three times a day. She'd roll them over, pin them down for no apparent reason, growling at them if they didn't lie quietly. I noticed, too, that the puppies she chose were the most outgoing and dominant in the litter. She gave them regular reminders of her authority and the behavior she expected from them. I've found that using her technique myself works very well on puppies that've become too big for their britches!

Even with their mothers, puppies act a lot like kids -- they're always testing and pushing their limits. They have angel days and devil days. With patience, persistence and a few hints from your puppy's mother, you'll be able to tip the balance toward the angel's side!

Goldens4Ever
October 10th, 2006, 06:49 PM
Violeta,

Don't get discouraged; your pup will learn :thumbs up I agree with Dakar that consistency is the key here, along with puppy obedience classes in the future. Puppies don't know any better; they do not know how to behave until we train them. We went through this with both our girls (the biting, nipping, etc.). All we had to do to teach them that biting was unacceptable, playing or otherwise, was place our hand over the top of her mouth and squeeze gently when she went to bite and firmly say, "NO BITE, NO BITE." We would do this constantly throughout the day. We were more consistent with our youngest golden, so we only had to do this for about two weeks and there has never been a problem since! Consistency, consistency, consistency.

Simply saying, "NO" when they bite, jump up, bark, etc. is not helpful......no what??? You need to label/name the behavior so that they know what you are telling them not to do, i.e. NO BITE, NO JUMP, NO BARK, etc. It works. By placing your hand over the top of their mouths and gently squeezing when they go to bite or have already bitten, also shows them that you are dominant, as dogs often try to show dominance with one another by placing their mouths or paws over each other's mouths. My two girls do this all the time.

Your in-laws need to understand that discipline/training is actually 'LOVE" (when exhibited properly), not cruelly. The principles are the same when raising children. They must be disciplined/trained so that they learn how to behave and the difference between right and wrong; this shows them that we care enough about them to discipline them. This is the same for children and puppies. We, the adults, are responsible for that. Perhaps explain this to your in-laws and perhaps they will see discipline in another light.

As far as your puppy not being as affectionate towards you because you are the 'disciplinarian,' don't take it to heart. Just cuddle and play with her as much as possible and the bond will develop. Puppy obedience classes is a great way to bond with your pup too, and I agree with Pug lover that it would be beneficial for all three of you to attend the classes! Other great ways to bond with your puppy is through bodily desensitization and grooming. To get your puppy accustomed to grooming needs (trimming paws, nails, ears, brushing teeth, etc.) start desensitizing her by rubbing her legs, feet, belly and ears; start brushing her teeth, gently. Get her used to a cotton ball rubbing the inside of her ear and a brush going down her back. All of these things bring you closer to her, as it is one-on-one time together--just you and her. I absolutely love the time I spend grooming my girls because it is close, intimate time with them and they know whatever I am doing is for their good.

Just some ideas...

Goldens4Ever
October 10th, 2006, 06:59 PM
I also completely agree with Jessi76 to redirect them to an acceptable object to bite, so that the pup knows that this is something they can bite--eventually she will be able to distinguish between what's acceptable and unacceptable. I am glad that Jessi76 mentioned this--awesome tip, and it works!!! We would, as I said earlier, place our hand over their mouths and gently squeeze while saying, "no bite," and then give them something they could bite on.

Someone mentioned that all you need to say is "no," but you want the dog to learn what you are saying "no" about. Whether I tell my girls, no bark, no bite, or no jump, they know exactly what each of those words mean (the behaviors). That is why it is helpful to label the behavior so that they can identify what it is they are doing that you do not want them to do.

MyBirdIsEvil
October 10th, 2006, 07:01 PM
I agree with everyone else, this puppy is extremely young, and she's not challenging you or even so much as thinking about your pack status, because at 9 weeks it's not even on her radar.
Also, this may count, she is not submissive at all, would not stay on her back unless you scratch her belli

This has nothing to do with submission, young puppies are often very hyper, and being on their back for more than a couple of seconds is torture to them. When older dogs lay on their back submissively it's an automatic behavior, you are pack leader so they roll over for you, but as I said, a 9 week old puppy isn't even thinking about pack status, so that means nothing. Besides that, even with an older dog you don't try and force them on their back to elevate your status, if you are pack leader a simple hand snap or a strong gesture will cause them to roll over and submit. Trying to force a dog on their back is dangerous and can cause injury to either of you, because their first instinct is that they're trapped so they need to get away by flailing or biting.

then I pushed her again and at this time she growled at me (not in play, it was a very stand offish, serious growl !
I honestly don't think at 9 weeks she's giving you a "serious growl". When you say "no!" and then push her with your foot she thinks you're playing. Pushing a puppy with your foot doesn't mean "get off" to them, look at how they play with each other, they jump on each other and run around and they're very physical, so when you push with your foot it's a signal to play.
I agree with angiesman and jessi, you must either say "no!" and ignore her or put her in her crate for a few minutes. If you use physical force it could either scare her or make her want to play, which does nothing.

Prin
October 10th, 2006, 07:20 PM
Some young puppies do have aggression issues... I thought it wasn't possible, but I met one. A seriously mean, mean, MEAN puppy. Very aggressive and dominant. Horrible, horrible 8 week old puppy. Aggressive and horrible at that age, I wondered how much training would help it. (Not saying it's the same in your situation. I'm saying that I met a bad one).

Goldens4Ever
October 10th, 2006, 07:38 PM
Prin-

I am curious about the environment that the 'bad puppy' lived in. Was it an unhealthy environment (and did the puppy have owners that just did not know how to train) or was the puppy just plain bad? The reason why that sparked my interest is because dogs (and children) can have the best that money can buy but still be bad because the owners (parents) did not effectively discipline/train them. Curious...... Just like some people believe that certain breeds of dogs are inherently aggressive; I don't know....

Prin
October 10th, 2006, 08:09 PM
Goldens4ever, this puppy was 8 weeks old and was just adopted at the spca. Not much room for owner error in an 8 week old (and definitely not with them because they just picked him up). IMO, the spca should not have adopted him out at all.

Goldens4Ever
October 10th, 2006, 08:23 PM
Prin-

Yes, yes, I see; my error. When I originally read your post, I did not see that the pup was only 8 weeks old :sorry: I agree completely.

Prin
October 10th, 2006, 08:29 PM
I agree with you too- bad owners can turn any dog into a disaster.

technodoll
October 10th, 2006, 08:33 PM
i too have met a "bad apple" or two before... super young things who thought they were king of the puppy pile... siblings all sweet and normal and this puppy just NASTY with no sense of right or wrong... :shrug: it happens.

violeta not saying this is YOUR puppy, just saying that yes SOME puppies do show aggression at that age, it is NOT play growling, and it has to be nipped in the bud asap or the problem will only get bigger with the puppy... have you started puppy boot camp yet? :dog:

x.l.r.8
October 11th, 2006, 10:56 AM
Not sure if I can help but I'll try, first off many people with have far more experience than I but there was one line in the handout that I got from my trainer I live by, it says "We are resonsible for designing this training program, not your neighbour, family member or individual you met on the street". With that in mind most of the stuff they have taught me echo's with the majority of views in what you will hear on this board. I have an older puppy and the crate punishment did NOT work, he was suposed to be crate trained and that meant he didn't pee in the crate but he was a wreck after we left him for 3 hours, so we tried to use if for punishment for 2 minutes and have nothing in the crate, and now we have a dog terrified of the crate, our trainer has us reshaping the behaviour and we feed and treat in the crate (door open), toys are fetched from inside the crate and occasionally he just goes in there and lies down. We have found 'ignor' is best (only to be done without the 'out-laws' around) and you get on with what you are doing. You already have a life and you pup will soon realise that puts you up on the list, making time in that life will only make the alfa thing stronger. I, like everyone else think you need to get yourself a GOOD trainer and get some basics started, that way you break the barrier and she will want to do things for you, you will soon find that you can shape behaviour. The in-laws will either get tired or the 'reward' they are offering may not be sufficient compaired to what you have to offer. You can also be sneaky, Riley is taught NEVER to take from a closed hand, EVER. This means when someone offers him a treat he looks away (my proudest achievement) and looks striaght to me. You have to aproach him with an open hand or it's not allowed. Little things like this will ensure you have your puppys attention and devotion and makes next step easier. Let others lavish attention but be brave and say when it's enough. Everyone has given great advise and I have rambled on far longer than I should. I would TRY what other have sugested, but please use the internet and word of mouth (local shelter and vets) and find a trainer who will work with you and see what you need to do to make the relationship work. And I leave you with a few more words from my new guru's "KEEP IT FUN". Good luck.:fingerscr

Violeta
October 11th, 2006, 11:40 AM
I am already doing all this. I give her tons of toys (rope, little squeaky things, kong, rubber bone shape toys and some stuffed animals) and already chooses those over the furniture or other stuff.

She is “nice” as in not biting only when she is dead tired and in my lap sleeping but she ALWAYS chews on something, if it’ s not my socks then it’s my hand or jumps to get my hair. I’ve been telling her no and then give her something appropriate to chew on and she does. Also, when she is in the playpen she is just licks and sweet as a button, you take her out and put her on the floor and she starts mouthing again! So, she knows to be gentle when she wants to; to see what she does, I got some banana on my fingers and she licked it, didn’t nip of bite at all.

I think that this is what she understands by playing. I didn’t see any toys at the breeder’s home so maybe all she had ware her brothers to play with and they ware rough :sad: . Poor little baby :yell:

That one thing that I find unacceptable is her growling. I know that puppies chew and bite in play and can get a little rough but growling this young scares me, how do I know if she is very serious or is just play and should I say NO to that when she does it? :shrug:

I posted this thread because I want to do the right thing :thumbs up , I am sure that she can get over this I just need the right approach. I don’t want to be tough with her at all, she is so young and willing to learn and this would be the time to teach her right? before it becomes a real problem ...

When comes to the time out. I need her to be happy in her crate – playpen but if I give her time out and I put her in there wouldn’t she think that every time she is in the crate she is punished?

Thank you all for the posts, very good information.

Violeta
October 11th, 2006, 11:46 AM
When I said that I discipline her I meant teach her what is right to do and what is not. I am never rough with her, I am actually always very, very gentle o show her that gentle is the way to do it, I never hit any of my dogs and I am not about to start now!

Maybe is the language barrier …lol. It’s hard sometimes to say exactly what I want to get across :sorry: .

I basically want to know what is best to do in this situation for her and for me.

Violeta
October 11th, 2006, 11:52 AM
Changing her behavior and tendencies isn't something that will happen overnight, at this point in her young life, the best you can do is shape her personality by rewarding the good girl and minimally ignoring (with NO! and timeouts) the bad.

My thinking exactly ! :highfive:



“your lack of patience and understanding is what is unacceptable” ouch !! :D I do have patience and understanding, what I don’t have is knowledge how to deal with an outgoing mouthy pup, I have always had shy, very submissive dogs and now I am not exactly sure what to do :shrug: . I need the training more then she does :thumbs up .

I want to learn and I want to know what is normal, what is not and how to raise her properly.



"i too have met a "bad apple" or two before... super young things who thought they were king of the puppy pile... siblings all sweet and normal and this puppy just NASTY with no sense of right or wrong... :shrug: it happens"

I don’t think that she is biting intentionally but I also think that she did snap at me when I pushed her away and picked her up. Does this mean that she doesn’t see me as alpha and she retaliated back? :shrug:
I need to understand her :rolleyes:

MyBirdIsEvil
October 11th, 2006, 12:40 PM
I agree that young puppies can have aggression problems, I just don't think it's a pack status thing at that point, it's more of a mental imbalance, and it doesn't seem to me that violetas puppy has that problem. It just sounds like the puppy has lots of prey drive and energy (which it sounds like violeta isn't used to), hence the growling at her foot and attacking it when she pushes it.
I think the only thing to really do in this situation is be patient with the puppy and do the "NO!" and ignore thing. Giving the puppy a toy only works well with chewing, but this is a nipping problem.
Violeta, you also may want to try playing lots of fetch games with your puppy, this often helps to get energy out with high prey drive dogs, and they also learn to chase and attack the toy, not YOU. The only problem you may have with this is her nipping your hand when you try to get her to release the toy, and what you do in this situation is trade toys. When she brings the toy to you give the release command and hand her a seperate toy.
I have a very high prey drive dog btw, and your puppy sounds a lot like mine when she was younger. We didn't have much experience with dogs like this when we got her and we mistook it for aggression, though it wasn't. She's now (at a year old) one of the most sweet dogs and she never bites or nips (though it took quite a bit of work when she was a puppy).
I hope this helps.

MyBirdIsEvil
October 11th, 2006, 01:02 PM
This is a pretty good description of the difference between prey drive and actual aggression towards people.

http://www.petplace.com/dogs/predatory-aggression/page1.aspx

Btw, when your in laws play tug of war with your puppy, not only are they elevating her pack status, they're honing her prey drive, which only makes her chasing biting and growling worse, so you definitately need to stop them from doing this, because it will only make it harder to train her out of it or direct her drive towards other objects. Tug of war is a good game to play to teach high prey drive dogs to direct their behavior towards an object, BUT it must be done in the right way, and I kind of doubt your in laws are doing that.

Also IMO, trying to get a high prey drive dog to bottle up their energy only makes it worse, so that's why it's important to direct their energy towards games such as fetch instead of just expecting them to completely stop their behavior.

I used to have TONS of articles on teaching high energy dogs fetch and other games, but since Walnut is older I don't have them anymore, but I'll try to find you some if you think your dog matches that description.

Goldens4Ever
October 11th, 2006, 07:17 PM
Why would you just give a dog the general, "NO," as opposed to labeling the behavior that you don't want them to do, so that they can associate the NO with the BEHAVIOR. NO Jump (this tells them that what they are doing is called "jumping," and you do not want them to), NO Bite (this tells them that what they are doing is called "biting" and you do not want them to do this), etc., etc., etc. Simply saying, "NO" will signal to them that you want them to quit whatever they are doing, but wouldn't it be better for them to know the name of their undesirable behavior??? "No what" their brains are thinking???

mona_b
October 12th, 2006, 12:04 AM
redirect her to appropriate chew toys, praise and/or treat when you see her using a toy (and NOT biting you),

Exactly........:thumbs up

This is what I have told alot of people to do.Don't forget now,she is teething also.

What you need to do is as soon as she starts biting,say her name then give the "no biting" command.When she stops,give her a toy,(right away)then praise like crazy.This doesn't just apply to her biting.This also applies to her chewing on things she shouldn't.

As for the time out in the crate,not a good idea.I never crate trained my dogs,but I have been told by many people and trainers that the crate should NOT be used for punishment.

Goldens4Ever,I am so with you on that one.They need to learn what the different No's are about.That's how my guys where taught.

And 9 weeks is not to young to be away from Mom and siblings.There is actually a law that states pups should not be sold under 8 weeks...I'll have to find it.I know it was posted here quite some time ago.

I would deffinately stop the pushing her away.She does see it as play.And you don't want that.

Violeta,you really need to have a talk with the In-Laws....Let them know that a spoiled little puppy will grow up to have serious issues.And they need to be firm with her.Tell them you are trying to raise a well behaved dog,and that them spoiling her is not going to help.;)

jessi76
October 12th, 2006, 08:15 AM
As for the time out in the crate,not a good idea.I never crate trained my dogs,but I have been told by many people and trainers that the crate should NOT be used for punishment.

I agree it shouldn't be used as "punishment", but it is possible to use the crate as a place for the pup to calm down. I was just suggesting a solution that was put forth to me in puppy classes (by my trainer)... if you do it right, by not saying a word, being calm in your body language, the pup isn't being punished. it's imperitive that you are calm, business-like, quiet and gentle when doing this. it worked like a charm on my dog, who is crate trained, and to this day, loves his crate.

Violeta
October 12th, 2006, 10:03 AM
What about her real growling and actual aggression that she is sometimes showing :shrug: , very different then her chewing and mouthing? If she does this at 2-3 months old … :sad:

Goldens4Ever
October 12th, 2006, 11:19 AM
Mona B-

I am right on with everything you said.

We were told by several trainers that when a puppy is showing aggression, to gently grab the dog by the chest hairs around the neck (scruff) and shake the dog briskly while telling it in a VERY harsh voice "BE NICE" or "PLAY NICE." Then when the dog settles down and starts behaving in an acceptable manner, praise him/her enthusiastically. We have only had to do this with our girls a handful of times. It is neither a cruel method that would cause them to become afraid nor is it a passive method that would make them think you are playing around with them.

Technodoll also mentioned doing this in her post (speaking of someone else who does this) and it is effective!!!! Look at her post on 10 Oct 6:39 p.m. Technodoll also mentioned the notion of pinning thim down so that they lie quietly. We also learned this from trainers and have done this, which also is very effective. It puts the dogs in a situation of complete submission where YOU are in control. With our oldest golden, we did this with her not only when she was playing too rough, but also when she was overly hyper and needed to calm down. We would pin her on the floor and rub the backs of her front legs (which she LOVES) and tell her, "Good girl, CALM, Good girl, CALM." Doing this immediately put her in submission, calmed her down, and showed her how we wanted her to behave. She grew to not mind us lying her down on the floor anymore because she knew she would get the backs of her legs rubbed :angel:

It would certainly behoove you to try implementing some of these more assertive techniques with your girl. Passive and non-assertive techniques do not work with strong-willing dogs, which it sounds like yours may be. That's OKAY. These techniques will break her will, but NOT her spirit, which is what you want :thumbs up