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Concern over Lump on Dogs Lip

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 10:51 AM
Hello Everyone!!
First my dog, Daisy has been to the vet.:love:
She has a lump on her lip and the vet said it was some type of nodule (which is french to me) and perscribed Animax cream to put on it twice a day. For starters she licks it off almost immediately. We try to entertain her but hey shes a dog.
Well now it looks like its growing so I think we are going back to the vet. My question is.......the vet made it sound like it was common in dogs and that within a few weeks (3 or 4) it should clear up on its own, but since we've seen him ( 1 week ago) its gotten bigger. So has anyone heard of this and is it common. The lump is red/pink and doesnt seem to bother her although she does have trouble eating from time to time. But I can touch it and she doesnt seem bothered but you have to bend her lip back to look at it. You can see it just looking at her but you can get a better view when you bend back her lip. Its round but not like a bump. Youd expect it be round all over but its round but has a flat top.
So anyhow Ive spent hours on line looking for it and I found this site so hopefully someone can shed some light on this for me. Ill be taking her back to the vet next week sometime.
Thanks so much
Liz

Prin
December 7th, 2005, 11:20 AM
It's not a wart? Would you be able to post a pic?

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 11:47 AM
Ok I had my daughter take these while I held Daisy. Hopefully these are good enough that you can see it.....
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b179/lizk729/doglip2.jpg
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b179/lizk729/doglip1.jpg
Can you see it well enough??
Thanks
Liz

Prin
December 7th, 2005, 12:01 PM
That's HUGE! I really didn't expect it to be that big! Wow! They can't remove it surgically? I don't think cream will do anything at all.

Roxy's_MA
December 7th, 2005, 12:05 PM
It is really big. I would definatly get back to a vet.

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 12:18 PM
He didnt say anything about surgery. He said that it was normal in dogs ages 1 year to 4 years and that it would clear up on its own in time. He has some sort of lab at his office and he scraped over the lump on her lip and checked it out in his microscope and said it was not anything to be concerned over. He gave me this cream which is nystatin-neomycin sulfate thiostrepton-tiramcinolone acetonide cream. And he said it might help but otherwise it should clear up on its own in a few weeks. He did mention it might be bigger but then it should shrink. I didnt think it would get this big! This is the first time Ive been to this vet. I normally take my animals to a low cost shelter for shots and when they got fixed. Ive taken Daisy to one other vet before this gentleman but I did not like the care we received so this is the first time with this man and he was verrrry nice, so I trusted what he was saying. Ill just give them a call and see if I can get her back in.
Thanks
Liz

Rottielover
December 7th, 2005, 12:45 PM
I have never seen that before in any dogs I know. I know alot of them. Get a second opinion, get it removed.

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 01:17 PM
Ok I went and got out the actual paperwork from the visit.
He calles a Histiocytoma, benign inflammatory nodule.
He types on this that it can be removed if it enlarges and persists beyond about a month.
Ok On hold with the vet................
brb

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 01:24 PM
Ok heres the scoop.........
They do not want to do surgery if they dont absolutely have to. Its in a delicate area that will be very hard to get enough skin to close it up and for it to heal correctly. They said as long as its not bothering her, which it doesnt seem to be, then to give her until after the holidays. They said for me to put the cream on more often, BUT ITS HER MOUTH.....lol she licks it off as soon as I free her and I can only hold her there with her mouth shut for a minute or so. So we are going to wait and see. They said that after three weeks it should start to disappear. Its been about three weeks now so I cant see it getting any bigger but we will wait and see.
Thanks everyone for your imput. I really appreciate it.
Liz

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 01:35 PM
Ok I found this information on the internet about what Daisy has. Just so people can have it for further knowledge.:) I just didnt have a name for the thing on her lip and now I know.:) Histiocytoma.:) Thanks again everyone!!
Liz


Histiocytoma






The typical patient is a young adult dog (usually less than 2 years of age) with a round eroded growth somewhere on the front half of its body.

What Might this Growth Be?

The good news is that the patient is probably too young to have a serious malignancy; still, one wants to be certain. The ringworm fungus can produce some raised round reactions called kerions, which can look similar. The chances are, however, that the growth in question is a histiocytoma, a common benign tumor that will eventually go away by itself.

The histiocytoma is a tumor originating from what is called a Langerhans cell. This cell lives in the skin and serves as part of the immune system by processing incoming antigens and presenting them to other immunologic cells. The histiocytoma is especially common in Labrador retrievers, Staffordshire terriers, Boxers, and Dachshunds. It is not related to the malignant process called histiocytosis.

Finding Out for Sure

Most of the time the tumor is small enough for easy removal and the diagnosis comes up on the biopsy report, confirming that the tumor is benign and will not grow back. If the tumor is in a location where removal is not easy (such as the middle of the ear flap or dangerously close to the eye) there are two other options: biopsy of a small piece of growth or cytology exam.

Biopsy may require sedation depending on the location of the growth. Sometimes a local anesthetic is enough. A small piece of tissue is snipped off and sent to the lab for analysis. In a few days we will know for sure exactly what the growth is.

Less costly but also less accurately, cells can be withdrawn from the lesion by a needle or simply collected from the tumor surface by pressing a microscope slide to the tumor surface. This omits the ability to see the architecture of the tissue and just the cells are available for examination. This may be enough for the lab to confirm the identity of the growth in question.

What to Do with a Histiocytoma

On the average, a histiocytoma undergoes regression by itself within 3 months. This process may be itchy or may lead to minor infection. Removal of the histiocytoma is the fastest routine to resolution but, since they do go away on their own, leaving the growth along is reasonable (as long as we know for sure it is a histiocytoma). Topical therapy with a product containing DMSO and a cortisone derivative is helpful in controlling symptoms of irritation.

Prin
December 7th, 2005, 04:04 PM
Ech, not the Langerhans cells... (I just did a gazillion page paper on them a few weeks ago...) :D

If this vet is not comfortable with it, in all honesty, I'd have it removed somewhere else. Because of its delicate position, if you have it done, you might want to see a surgeon-- maybe at least a consult to see how much it would cost. I just wouldn't want my baby dealing with that for a long time.:( But like they say, it's your decision if it's non-cancerous.

lizk729
December 7th, 2005, 04:55 PM
Hello.:)
Actually it doesnt seem to bother her at all except for once in a blue moon when we give her something harder and bigger to chew. Like a carrot, then she whines a little but if we cut it up into bite sizes she doesnt complain at all. Shes her normal self.:love:
If it goes on for longer than the holidays then we will go see someone to have it removed.
Thanks
Liz

db7
December 7th, 2005, 08:35 PM
The vet is probably concerned because the growth is close to the lip. If they cut it out it will bleed like crazy and take a long time to settle.

lizk729
December 8th, 2005, 07:57 AM
The vet is probably concerned because the growth is close to the lip. If they cut it out it will bleed like crazy and take a long time to settle.

Thats the impression I get as well. She said its in a very bad location and anywhere else and they would have removed it already. She said its better to give her some more time and wait and see if it shrinks some on its own in the next few weeks. If it shrinks but does not go away totally then they can remove it because it wont be so swollen and large and then less likely to run into problems when they remove it. I pray that it goes away on its own though. I really dont want her to go through surgery.:sick: It really does not seem to bother her. It just looks painful.:sad: Shes such a wonderful baby and we love her to pieces. We just want to see her get better.
Thanks everyone!!

So Prin?? What causes these cells to do this?? Figure since you did a paper you might shed some light?? :confused: Is that what they are Langerhans cells?? All I know is they said its Histiocytoma?? I did a little research on it once I knew the actual name and that certainly looks and sounds like whats on her lip but I just wonder how it got there??

Oh and another concern I have is can it be passed to the Cat?? I should have asked the vet. Im thinking it cant because the vet knows we have a cat and he didnt say anything????

Liz

Prin
December 8th, 2005, 11:34 AM
I didn't understand exactly what Langerhans were (half of school is winging it...) but I think they're sort of the immune equivalent to stem cells that can be easily converted into any cell the immune system requires. But what happens is, they convert into a foreign cell instead of one useful to the body, and the foreign cell multiplies and causes a growth of abnormal tissue. If the tissue is "mean" and starts taking over adjacent cells then you get malignancy. But if the cells just grow on their own next to, but not disturbing adjacent cells, then you just have what you see on your doggy's lip. I think that's how it goes, but I'm not 100% sure.

lizk729
December 8th, 2005, 02:03 PM
Thanks:D That was more than I knew so that was helpful. lol
Strange things the body can do.....:rolleyes:

Prin
December 8th, 2005, 05:31 PM
Yep. That's why you have to stay out of the sun and don't get too many x-rays.;)