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November 10th, 2005, 01:46 PM
A friend is getting a new puppy and has had her 'dib's on it and paid for it since it was born. Now the 'breeder' is pushing for her to take it this weekend when it is not even 7 weeks old! Also, the breeder wants her to choose from a photo the puppy she wants, not visit the litter first, she wants to meet my friend in a car park somewhere and just hand it over on Saturday. Apparently, the 'breeder' has been in the business for 22 years (according to a copy of the e-mail my friend sent me), but surely this person can't be bona fide breeder to push the puppies out like that. What do you think?

November 10th, 2005, 01:51 PM
Yeah that sounds shifty to me. Did your friend visit the breeder prior to paying for the puppy? See the conditions and parents?

November 10th, 2005, 02:12 PM
No, I don't think she did. I've suggested to her that if she does go ahead and still take the puppy that she take it the vet straight away to be checked over.

November 10th, 2005, 02:15 PM
I would never buy a dog without seeing where it came from. It doesn't sound right. I wonder what she is hiding?

November 10th, 2005, 02:25 PM
Separating a puppy for its mother / littermates before 8 weeks is definitely not good. Most literature suggests that pups actually benefit behaviorally when left with the litter even a bit longer (I think ideal is around 10 weeks or so).

Also, a word of caution on buying a dog sight unseen. I did this once, put a deposit on a pup seen only on a breeder's website. Drove three hours to pick it up, took it home with some misgivings, and found out what a terrible mistake I had made. The pup was seriously agressive with my son. Not hyper, not puppy-ish, AGRESSIVE! I had several conversations with my vet and the breeder in the first two days, and thankfully the breeder was reputable enough to allow me to bring the pup back for a full refund.

I learned my lesson. The second time around I went to a shelter where I had a chance to meet the dog, and see how it interacted with my son. Harley has been a peach ever since day one!

November 10th, 2005, 02:30 PM
OH! And out of curiousity, I've watched the breeder's website over the past year, just to see her pups. I couldn't believe it when I saw that her last litter was apparently INBRED! I looked at both parents pedigrees posted on the site, and the sire of the latest litter just happened to be the father of the pregnant bitch. :mad:

November 10th, 2005, 02:36 PM
Roxy and her littermates were seperated from the mother at 8 weeks. The breeder kept her an additional 2 weeks with her littermates, but away from her mother. It is a very important to your friends puppy to be socialized with its littermates at that age. That is a very sensitive time in the puppy's development.

November 10th, 2005, 08:19 PM
I've had a doggy who was separated too early and her life mission was to attempt to kill every dog she ever ran into. When they're removed from the litter too early, they either become too submissive or overly aggressive with other dogs.

I would definitely back out of this deal. The "breeder" probably wants to make room for the next litter...:(

Lucky Rescue
November 10th, 2005, 08:32 PM
No reputable breeder would ever try and rush puppies out of the house prematurely.

On this fact alone, I would never deal with this person, never mind this::eek:
she wants to meet my friend in a car park somewhere and just hand it over on Saturday

Let the buyer beware.

November 10th, 2005, 09:13 PM
This is definately NOT a reputable breeder.

As LR stated,no reputable breeder would rush pups out prematurely.

Does this so called breeder show or have titles dogs?Have they been health/genetic certified?What contracts did your friend have to sign?

First off,your friend made the mistake of not going to see this "breeder"..I would definately tell her to tell this breeder that she will NOT meet her to have the pup handed over.Your friend must tell this person she want's to go to her place and pick the pup up.Does this breeder have a website?If so,the address should be on it.Tell your friend to go there and don't tell the breeder she is showing up....:D

My breeder didn't let her pups go untill they were 12 weeks.And they still hung out with Mom...I was on a waiting list.When the pups were born,I was able to see them when I wanted.My breeder along with many other reputable breeders will encourage this.

What breed is the pup?

Where is this breeder located?

November 10th, 2005, 09:32 PM
Yes walk away doing in a deal in a car park is definately a big red flag.

November 10th, 2005, 10:08 PM
Yes walk away doing in a deal in a car park is definately a big red flag.

Unfortunately the friend has already paid for this pup....:(

November 10th, 2005, 10:19 PM
I didnt pay close enough attention to the thread. I would definatley insist on seeing the parents and meeting them at their house instead of a parking lot.
If not I would ask for my money back.

Then it would be a hardcall if the breeder said no (which could happen) you could walk away consider it a lesson learned about non reputable breeders. But then you are supporting this non reputable breeder or possible puppymill by letting them keep the money and possibly breeding the puppy you didnt take.

November 10th, 2005, 10:29 PM
Oh my gosh! That's horrible - can she get her money back and return the puppy? I realize that may not be great for the puppy but this sounds like a most disruputable breeder. I suppose however there was a down payment et al and the breeder has already taken the money and ran!!

You should always be able to meet both parents, visit the puppies with their mom and littermates and look over where they are growing up. There are numerous other factors of course too but it's all irrelevant now I guess. I do hope her puppy turns out to be OK but why would she opt to purchased from someone like that - there were all kinds of red flags there.

November 10th, 2005, 11:05 PM
you could walk away consider it a lesson learned about non reputable breeders. But then you are supporting this non reputable breeder or possible puppymill by letting them keep the money and possibly breeding the puppy you didnt take.

Daizy is not the one who got this pup,her friend did.

Also we need to remember that there are MANY people who don't know what a puppymill or BYB are.And don't know the difference between a BYB and a reputable breeder....:)

November 11th, 2005, 08:36 AM
Thanks for all your responses. Well ... my friend called me last night and said that when she called the 'breeder' and started asking questions, the 'breeder' said that she was insulted (& more) and she couldn't now have the pup, and she would send her, her money back. So, I guess time will tell if she does actually get her money back. The pup is a bichon frise/poodle mix. Obviously, my friend is disappointed as she has been looking forward to it. But maybe as some of you suggested the 'breeder' had something to hide and got frightened by all the questions! There are some lovley Bichon Frise dogs on which I have forwarded to her, so hopefully this will ease her disappointment. I hope the pup ends up in a good home though.

November 11th, 2005, 08:49 AM
A proper breeder wouldn't be offended by a buyer asking questions.
And one should always be able to choose their puppy, to pick the temperment that suits them best. I would want to meet the mama before she whelped too. A reputable breeder wouldn't mind showing off their goods, and being well informed lets them know that you won't let them rip you off.
I guess it's a lesson to all others, ask before you pay, saves time and heartache.

November 11th, 2005, 09:27 AM
When I got Harley, it was sight unseen. But this breeder was a referal from a breeder I did 2 years of research on. I did not get to meet her, or the dam first, she was 7 hours away. BUT I saw pics, I knew of, and have seen Harley grandsire. Mother was from the breeder I did the research on. I did not choose my Puppy, I am glad about that. Breeders know there dogs better than anyone, they find the puppy that best suits your needs. It worked out wonderful.
I told my breeder I did not want any pics of Harley before I pick him up, which was at 9 1/2 weeks old. Wanted it to be a surprise. So as sneaky as she was, LOL, she sent me a pic of his brother to show me. LOL
I am living proof that if you find a breeder/friend/confident. You do not have to physically see the dam. But I reccomend you do a heck of alot of research, and befriend your breeder before hand.

Lucky Rescue
November 11th, 2005, 10:10 AM
The pup is a bichon frise/poodle mix

Breeding and selling mutts on top of it all.