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my 9 wk old puppy bites and draws blood HELP

yoda900_ca
August 24th, 2005, 11:04 PM
HELP
I have a 9wk old alaskan malamute puppy. Let me start my saying this is not the first mal i've owned or been around frequently. Our last mal would let our then infant/toddler son climb on him and pull on him and when he had enough would simply walk away. Most of the time he just wanted to kiss the baby. We took Goku hove at just under 7weeks so we will have him 3wks on fri. He'll be 10wks sat. We picked him out from the breeder at 4wks of age and went for puppy visit weekly. This dog was friendly outgoing and loved to give kisses. The breeder assured us he was not the alpha male of the group and after looking at all the puppies it was kind of easy to see who was pushy. This guy seemed easy going. I also met all of the breeders other dogs who were very friendly and sweet. Even the mom with new puppies was friendly. She is a small show breeder and only has 3 dogs.
When we first brought goku home he seemed more mouthy then usuall . After a few days his bites became very hard espcially with our 10yrold. We tried the ow and walk away this only seemed to encourage him to bite when next our son would approach. Kind of a ha i won attitude. After about 5 days of things getting worse tried flipping him saying no and giving a shake.
The 2nd time we did this he kept tring to bite so we would hold him till he calmed down. He would walk away pout and come back after a min or 2 and give kisses. AS my son would tell him No for biting the bites would get harder and after a flip he would come back from a pout and bite my son and run. I told the breeder she recomended a fly swatter.She felt goku wanted alex to be his litter/playmate AS i contemplated this idea yesterday, he ran into the neighbors yard and choose not to come and dig the neighbors plants instead. I yelled no and the digging continued i went to retrieve him and picked him up at that point he bit me and drew blood. I gave him a very hard correction. He yelped but continued to try and bite. He only calmed down once my hubby camed to see what the comotion was.
Today he was a saint. He did get slightly nippy with my son alex said no and gave him a toy to chew on instead of him. everything seemed to be going great. I thought ok this dog gets NO. Until about 8pm. alex had been playing with him 45 min. he trotted of to go chew on his kong. alex and i were on the sofas talking. alex was laying on it when goku came up to him alex said hi and goku jumped up bit his upper arm and drew blood. Alex yelled no (and then started to cry)as did i and he went growling and teeth bared to go for him again. (mind u this dog is already 20lbs) I grabbed goku and he attacked me. I gave him a very stearn shake correction. however he continued to bite at me till i calmed him. He drew blood on me again as well. I feel he bit me more out of fear but what concerns me is the attack on alex. So what are we doing wrong. The harder the correction the worse this dog seems to get. HELP I've never had a problem with a puppy like this.
I will say the dog is very smart. he is house broken and has figured out how to open the screen door and take himself out to the bathroom id u don't get there fast enough. He knows sit and down and come which is optional depending on what he is doing at the time. he love to play chase but NEVER bites anyone in this game or in hide and go seek or any game for that matter usually only in quite time.
So I'm open to any advice i love this little guy except 4 the bitting. He brings us toys to play with him and drops them at our feet. He goes 4 walks w/me 2-3 times a day and loves to go new places. It breaks my heart because my son thinks the dog doesn't love him or why would he hurt him. I feel were so very far on the wrong track but not sure what is the right track. SO THANKS 4 any advice

badger
August 25th, 2005, 01:30 AM
I'm sure some much more experienced people here will give you specific advice, but just reading your post made me dizzy. This is a BABY (taken from his mother several weeks too early, I might add) and your expectations are way too high. One thing's for certain: if you go on hitting him, he will go on biting, and soon become a dog NOBODY wants.

yoda900_ca
August 25th, 2005, 06:53 AM
Sorry maybe i lead u to beleive he was being hit. this is NOT the case. He was being flipped on his back and given a shake, Much like a mother dog would correct him. This puppy has NEVER been struck. The breeder wanted me to use a fly swatter or flick the end of his nose with our fingers something i never got around to doing because i felt the aggression from him was escalting and i did not quite feel ccomfortable with(esp the fly swatter) His other less serious aggressiveness that has shown up in the past week are growling at toys and yipping and growling at strangers who pass the yard. However when out on a walking he displays typical malamute behavior and wants everyone to pet him. I do agree he was on the young side when we picked him up but the breeder had to have surgery and she felt 7 wks would be ok 4 us to take him. None of the other puppies are displaying these traits(9total in the litter) as i am in contact with both the breeder and the other owners. Again i am looking for ideas on how to STOP this aggresive biting.

StaceyB
August 25th, 2005, 07:14 AM
How old was he when you brought him home?

yoda900_ca
August 25th, 2005, 08:40 AM
One day shy of 7weeks; He was the last puppy picked up; 4 of the puppies had left 3-4 days earlier. We waited as long as possible.

StaceyB
August 25th, 2005, 08:46 AM
That was a good idea. How social was his mother? Do you have him enrolled in puppy classes yet?

yoda900_ca
August 25th, 2005, 09:32 AM
the mother was very social. At our first visit she was nervous to have people around the puppies but if you removed her from the puppies she would love u up. She was not aggressive when u were near her puppies and she was there but obviously stressed. Our first visit was at 31/2wks. we then went for weekly visits at the breeders home with our puppy so it wouldn't be a nervous when we brought him home. By almost six wks the puppies mother was almost glad 4 u to take your puppy out to play. I also interacted with the breeders other 2 show dogs who were very friendly. They are the puppies grandmother and grandfather. The puppies father was not on site but i could have visited him he was about a 2 hour drive away and we opted not 2. I also met 2 previous puppies for a liter with these same 2 parents from 14months ago. Both those dogs were great. I called a trainer this am and am taking him in for an evaluation on friday. Being that he is only 91/2wks most puppy classes won't take him till12wks

Trinitie
August 25th, 2005, 04:01 PM
Do not alpha roll this dog! He seems to have trust issues, and rolling him will make him not trust you at all.

Keep his leash on him at all times. Do not leave him outside by himself. He's far too young to know to come to you when called, and still a bit young to know the word "no". You hit it right on the head when you said he bites and you tell him NO, and give him a toy to chew. Keep that up!

Your pup may not have been alpha in his litter, but he's trying to climb the ladder at home. This dog is going to require lots of tender training. If you appear to be threatening to him, he's going to respond.

Perhaps Tenderfoot can lend some expertise to this.

yoda900_ca
August 25th, 2005, 04:19 PM
ok thank you for the advice. I will continue to do that with the toy. How should i reinforce that No Means No. I want him to not feel threatened but I also can't have him attacking my 10yr old un provoked. He has been good today except when he went into the neighbors yard and my son retrieved him him threaten with bites and growls but did not bite when my son picked him up. still an improvement from yesterday. he loves to play hide and seek with my son and chase games. He gets distracted sometimes and runs of to the other yard and doesn't want to leave. He is very curious and loves the outside but should i still leash him when playing tag? kinda hard to do. Also he let's himself out to the bathroom but we then follow and go out with him. So far we can't get him to do #1 or #2 on a leash but he goes the second he is off. Go figure.

Lucky Rescue
August 25th, 2005, 04:34 PM
I'm sure some much more experienced people here will give you specific advice, but just reading your post made me dizzy. This is a BABY (taken from his mother several weeks too early, I might add) and your expectations are way too high. One thing's for certain: if you go on hitting him, he will go on biting, and soon become a dog NOBODY wants.

Agree 100%

You took this baby way too young, before he was able to learn bite inhibition, as he would have with his siblings and his mom.

He is a tiny baby. When your child was 1 year old, and would pinch you, bite, scratch you or grab someone's earrings or glasses, did you roll him over to teach him who is boss?

The breeder wanted me to use a fly swatter or flick the end of his nose with our fingers
This shows what kind of "breeder" this is, and I wouldn't take her advice on anything.

The harder the correction the worse this dog seems to get.
Malamutes tend to NOT be submissive dogs. As you see, you need to find another way to train your puppy. At 100 lbs as an adult, he may decide to really retaliate against "hard corrections" and then you'll really have a problem.

Hitting of any kind is abuse, and abuse is not training. Puppies are a great deal of work and anyone not prepared for mouthing, biting, chewing, peeing and pooping should not get one.

I suggest you talk to a trainer, one who knows how to raise puppies without rolling, shaking or hitting them. You can get a few private sessions if your puppy is too young for classes.

Roxy's_MA
August 25th, 2005, 04:47 PM
Yoda900_CA This is completly of the topic of the thread, but I just wanted to tell you that I love love love the name you choose for your dog. :D

yoda900_ca
August 25th, 2005, 05:06 PM
Geeze can anybody read. An alpha roll is different from hitting thier is no hitting involved and no offence if you read my post then u should realize i have had mals before. I alpha rolled my first mal twice and he was as good as gold. I realze mal continue to test u, believe me. I also have never had a puppy act like this before. And believe me i know what i am was getting into. puppy mouthing is way different from a dog attacking unprovoked while a child sits on the sofa. I appricate your negative comments but i'm really looking for some constructive advice on how to train not a moral superior response over a post that you only skimmed. Many trainers use alpha rolls as with everything not all training meathods work with all dogs but if u had actually read the whole post or thread u would realize that i had stopped doing an alpha roll when i saw the aggression escalting . I've had 1 PERSON give me some useful advice never dreaming the puppy had some possible trust issues. By the way my 1 yr old never bit anyone EVER to think you raise or treat dog like u would a human child is crazy. A dog does not have the comprehension level a child does and u have to speak dog language as i call it to them not human language.

Lucky Rescue
August 25th, 2005, 05:31 PM
I at no time said puppies and children should be raised the same way and have no idea where you got that form. I said that babies should not be punished for behaviors like this.

I never said YOU are hitting your puppy. I said that the fact that the breeder told you to do this is wrong.

Here is an article that may be helpful.
http://www.phsspca.org/training/puppy_biting.htm

I would also find a trainer who holds puppy classes. Your puppy would learn bite inhibition from playing with other puppies.

Your posts would be easier to read if you used paragraphs. No, this is not a criticism, merely a suggestion.

yoda900_ca
August 25th, 2005, 06:26 PM
thank you for the link. I have used that meathod in the past and it normally work with my collie and shep labx. With my other malamute in semi worked and i had to alpha roll twice and the problem was solved. With this puppy we tried that for over a 2weeks and it made no difference and the biting got harder and worseand more frequent. At this point we tried the alpha roll a few times now which only increase the aggression. I am taking hm to meet with a trainer tomorrow. I must say again that the comment about the trust issue was a good eye opener for me. We are continuing to replace biting with toys and we bought some bitter apple a few days ago and we try to keep this on the backs of my sonns hands. I am try to looking for the tigger that my be provoking him to suddenly draw blood on my son. Basically i see he wants to do what he wants to do (typical MALAmute)an usually this is when the biting ocures with the exception of last night. where an alpha roll would normally work in my opion w/that obnoxious attitude this little guy has a trust issue so i need a new way to reinforce no means no.

FYI -sorry i did post in paragraphs but didn't realize it pushed everything to a left margin will leave spaces nextI took Your coment about when my child was 1yr as a comparison of raising children and dogs in the same manner. Not sure why else it was there. Finally I'm SORRY i miss interpreted your post badger thought i was hitting him and since you quoted that section i thought u thought the same. I don't believe in hitting a puppy but am fine with the alpha roll theory.
Hopefully the trainer tomorrow will have some ideas. :fingerscr

Dina
August 25th, 2005, 06:36 PM
How Ironic. I entered the site to find out what to do about my biting puppy. Our situation is very similar. My mistake though was that I was told to use a newspaper and slap it against my hand to make a loud noise followed by a NO. That did not work...she got even more aggressive. Then my husband said to tap her nose. Did that ..it didn't work either. By reading a few of the replies I realize I have to be very calm an keep on with the NO and walk away. Can I reverse the damage I've already caused with my 2 1/2 y month old femal lab? I too have had puppies before and never experienced this aggression.