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Reality versus Political Correctness

Rick C
July 18th, 2005, 10:56 AM
This is an interesting story . . . . a female Ottawa police detective is admonished for political incorrectness regarding her comments on how women are treated in other cultures . . . . yet lower in the story, we see Canadian governments appearing to give the same comments on travel to Muslim countries.

Was the officer wrong or is the government right? Are we too PC at the expense of reality?

Don't mind me. Just being evil and setting off a bomb on the board. :clown:

http://www.canada.com/ottawa/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=140f31e1-4dd8-4288-815d-c9271e71a9a6

Rick C
www.goldentales.ca

Luvmypit
July 18th, 2005, 01:03 PM
Hmmm.
Touchy

All I know that I am very happy that I am a Canadian woman. We would be silly and counter productive to pretend that women all over the world are treated like they are in North America. Equal.

I think as long as she was adressing everyone and not a particular group then I don't see the harm in it. I am just afraid that because of three incidents they feel the need to talk to a particular group is kinda crossing the line. I am hoping that this is directed towards all men of all cultures. It wouldn't hurt for some canadian men to hear how to respect a woman also.
The issue I think these men have is they felt targeted due to some incidents of a select few.

Just like in an office you need sensitivity training for homosexuals, women in the workplace. Why can't the taxi drivers do the same considering they are abassadors to this country and are often the first person a tourist meets.
But to direct it towards them because of their countries policies is unfair.

I just think she could have made her point with out referencing their home countries.

As a woman in a multicultural city as Toronto is I have seen some disparaging things. Women sitting in the backseat while no one is in the front sitting with the husband. I even have a neighbour that won't talk to me and only to my SO. I wondered if it was because of my sex that I am ignored. But I don't like assuming either. But I just get this feeling from this guy. I will be out sitting right there even looking at him so we can at least exchange friendly smiles but he will look and look right away. But as soon as my SO comes out. Oh hi how are you...... To each their own i wouldn't want to be friends with anyone who thinks of me as a lesser being anyways. I thought maybe he doesn't like me but we just moved in so it seems unlikely.

jjgeonerd
July 18th, 2005, 01:33 PM
"Some of this behaviour may be acceptable in the countries they are from," Det. Kelm said. "Our message to them is that it's not acceptable here, and it won't be tolerated."

That's all she said? That's not insensitive, it's a fact. Geez...go to Europe. What is "accepted" there would bring about a lawsuit here!

PC has gone too far in general IMO. Everyone is too afraid of hurting everyone else's feelings.

pags
July 18th, 2005, 01:50 PM
I find the whole PC movement to have become completely bizarre.. and for exactly such reasons. The line between fact and opinion has become so blurred that apparently the only PC way to tell the difference is thus: If it might not look so good in a multi-cultural utopia then it cannot be fact.

I can't for the life of me figure out what is so offensive about this person's statement... Even the use of 'some' and 'may' as qualifiers is completely discounted and we're supposed to look at this as if she said the equivalent of "I know all you people from country xy and z are woman-hating scum..." I'll never be trained into the ranks of the thought police, I guess.

kandy
July 18th, 2005, 05:15 PM
I think people concentrate too much on the words that are uttered and not enough on the intent behind it. A PC friendly term, spoken with extreme sarcasm and/or hatred is just as bad as saying something directly inflammatory. I think that John Cougar Mellenkamp said it best, "It's all what you do and not what you say, if you're not part of the future then get out of the way".

I had a family from India in my office the other day. The boy was getting set up to take classes here and the father had an interest to meet the President of the college. While they were waiting for the President to see them, the father chatted with the director of Admissions, but I noticed that the woman kept her eyes on the floor and stood behind her husband at all times. Although it would really rankle me to take such a subservient role, I also understand that it is tradition in India, so I never attempted to talk to her. I do wonder how the boy will adjust to life in the US though - specifically how he will handle women in positions of authority.

melanie
July 18th, 2005, 06:17 PM
yay for foreward thinking canada again, its wonderful to see you are a society that is foreward thinking and ensuring that certain groups know about how your woman expect to be treated, yay for canada... i cant get anything offensive from that article, i jsut dont see what was wrong,


andh ey i dont believe in being PC, i think its stupid and hides true feelings and expressions and is a nother govt form of controling ppls opinions. and POLITICALLY CORRECT, ha that a joke word i think, well firstly whos politics will we use, whos politics is correct enough to use, and that is correct enough politically to be forced on others, and the CORRECTNESS ha crap, who determines what is correct, who determines what politics are correct to use?? as far as im concerned it cant exist, i mean really im not going along with a usa version of PC, no if anything i will go for an aussie version of PC, see my dilemma, each society and land has diff politics and versions of correctness and social behaviours, one country cannot force or uimpose its version of what is politically correct on another as we are too different and it wont work, its a crock of crap if you ask me and another smoke screen by govts to hide their real adgendas and keep the public quite, afraid and stupid but lets call it being PC....

in male dominated societies around the world woman are often not treated with the respect we have in aus and can, every culture is different and i cant see the harm in warning the taxi drivers, many woman in this world are oppressed, abused, controled and treated less than men. your country is trying to avoid the probles of multiculturalism by addressing them directly, even in australia we have these probs, i once had a taxi driver ask for a favor, i near took his head off as he had no right....

and if it means one girl is not assulted because of a drivers awareness of our rights and wrongs then it was all very worthwhile...

it will help protect woman from unwanted advance and help the taxi drivers to undferstand your society and its workings better.

it also means that if a woman is assulted the taxi driver canot claim he did not know, you should be so proud of your country for trying to protect woman and make life nicer for all.....

Rick C
July 18th, 2005, 07:16 PM
I had a family from India in my office the other day. The boy was getting set up to take classes here and the father had an interest to meet the President of the college. While they were waiting for the President to see them, the father chatted with the director of Admissions, but I noticed that the woman kept her eyes on the floor and stood behind her husband at all times. Although it would really rankle me to take such a subservient role, I also understand that it is tradition in India, so I never attempted to talk to her. I do wonder how the boy will adjust to life in the US though - specifically how he will handle women in positions of authority.

About 20 years ago, on the bald butt prairie in northwestern Alberta, I went out to a farm to see a guy about something.

He was out in the field so the wife, middle-aged, suggested we go out to see him in THEIR car.

We go outside and she immediately, without a word, gets into the passenger side of HER car.

We spend five minutes arguing, with me insisting that its her car and she should drive and her insisting that no, when a man is around, the man drives.

Finally, I give in and drive us out to the field . . .

There are also women in rural western Canada who to this day during an election will tell me: "My husband hasn't decided yet who we'll vote for."

Rick C
www.goldentales.ca

melanie
July 18th, 2005, 07:24 PM
rick what a post :D i know of some woman esp Indigenous in australia who live a bit like that, its hard for me even to imagine such a life or world as a woman, wow do i live in a very different world to many woman, which i am ever grateful for...... :love:

great to discuss this guys, its important to hear about woman and issues all aroudn the world.....

Prin
July 18th, 2005, 10:28 PM
Ouch. Rick, if I only knew that girlie!

I love feminism. I love where it is going. It's now becoming about choices, about how even if you are frowned upon for not having a career, you are still not free. Same with men. Why should a stay-at-home dad be treated differently than a stay at home mom? I think it's sexy and it's the next way to go. If the woman is more career oriented than the man, why can't he stay home?

As for being driven- I let my man drive. My car is getting old and it's not as fun to drive, so I let him drive me around. I'm getting my clutch redone though, so if it's all smooth again and I get my horsepower back, I might reconsider... :D

I wish everybody had the same choices we do.

Oh and I tell my man who to vote for. He knows I am really into it, so he just follows me along.