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Pit Bull Co-op - How will we cope?

babyrocky1
April 23rd, 2005, 12:51 PM
Okay guys, we are obviously going to have to cope with this discusting bill after August, so HOW do we do it. I know that some of yu have enough property to properly exercise your pits but what about those of us in apartments??? I have been gradually getting Rocky used to going rollerblading with me but he doesnt like it. He would rather be with me than stay home alone, but thats about all the enthusiasm he can muster. He loves to play Kong and play with his other dog friends. And what about the winter??? I cant jog cause I have arthritis from all the years of him pulling on the leash. Aside from the exercise, what about maintaining their socialisation??? I am probably going to have to get him a cage muzzle for rollerblading. I met a woman who had one of those nylon muzzles on her dog to get him used to it but she intentionally got it much too big! I didnt notice till I started to pat him. Do you think theyll be looking that close?? We need to get creative here if our dogs are going to be able to keep there quality of life! So I hope some of you havae ideas cause I dont!!!

seeker
April 23rd, 2005, 09:30 PM
I don't know what to tell you , other than I have and will continue to contribute to the court battle .
I have propery so my dogs will notice little change but I feel bad for those of you and your dogs that do not . It is something that none of us really know right now , I guess we will have to put our heads together on this and try to come up with some realistic ideas.

pollito
April 24th, 2005, 11:02 AM
well, i live in a house , but my mom doesn't let nakita out in the backyard, she wants to keep the grass green, so i walk her 3 times a day, and usually 2 of the walks are about 15-20 mins and one is about 1 hour - 2 hours depending on the weather, and usually it is enough for her. As soon as the weather will get warmer I will go to the small lake (I found a place where people don't usually walk even by, so it really is nice) (and just let her swim) about 3-4 times a week, (about 25 mins walk from my house and 25 back and about 1 and a half hours I spend there)

In the winter sometimes I used to let her off the leash, but an onleash good exercise is I take snowballs (or biscuits, or something that your dog likes and will enjoy jumping after), and just make her jump to get them, and I walk her as well.

twodogsandacat
April 24th, 2005, 10:27 PM
[QUOTE=babyrocky1]what about maintaining their socialisation??? [QUOTE]

Thereís the kicker. Muzzle the dog and donít allow it near other dogs. Now when some loose dog comes running up to your dog whatís going to happen? These dogs are now going to become apprehensive around other dogs. It sure sucks.

I too will continue to support the cause Ė because itís the right thing to do.

Hang in there. Socialization will most likely be presented as a secondary issue in the court case. This is a cause of unnecessary stress and anguish that has been bestowed upon thousands of innocent owners of innocent pits who acquired a pit bull type dog in full accordance with the law of the day. To subject these dog owners to this type of punishment for doing nothing other than owning and loving an animal is a violation of your rights.

Dukieboy
April 25th, 2005, 08:00 AM
Thats why I got Wizard for Duke because I thought it would reduce the impact of the new legislation. But, I don't walk them together because I am really feeling I have to be vigilant about other dogs. I try to see them coming and now I am the one crossing the street. I just don't need the b**lsh**t. I walk him were I expect there to be the least amount of dogs. What should be a stress reliever(walk) had now become a stressfull event. Almost every second house on my street has a dog but I know the owners have no interest in having thier dog interact with mine. Sad situation.

Kayla and Me
April 25th, 2005, 08:08 AM
[QUOTE=babyrocky1]Hang in there. Socialization will most likely be presented as a secondary issue in the court case. This is a cause of unnecessary stress and anguish that has been bestowed upon thousands of innocent owners of innocent pits who acquired a pit bull type dog in full accordance with the law of the day. .


It doesn't really matter because even if the law is changed, how are you going to change the minds of the other dogs owners who already have it in their heads that PitBulls are killers and their dogs are at risk? I back onto school yard and twice a day (morning and night) there are no less than 6 or 7 dogs running off leash for their exercise. I have been told outright by them, that they have discussed it amongst themselves, and Kayla is not welcome in their group. So my poor dog gets to run the length of the fence tortured twice daily, by their dogs and there is nothing I can do about it.

Hence, because I can't change 'them', I have decided that Kayla should not suffer for this. I am considering getting another dog from the pound. I will take her with me when we go looking so that I get a dog that she 'takes' to right away, even though it's going to be a little more work for me in the beginning, in the long run it I think it will be easier.

Anyone else considered this option?

Kayla and Me

Kayla and Me
April 25th, 2005, 08:23 AM
Thats why I got Wizard for Duke because I thought it would reduce the impact of the new legislation. But, I don't walk them together because I am really feeling I have to be vigilant about other dogs. I try to see them coming and now I am the one crossing the street. I just don't need the b**lsh**t. I walk him were I expect there to be the least amount of dogs. What should be a stress reliever(walk) had now become a stressfull event. Almost every second house on my street has a dog but I know the owners have no interest in having thier dog interact with mine. Sad situation.

Posting at the same time with the same problem and the same solution! Spooky! LOL

Kayla and Me

babyrocky1
April 25th, 2005, 11:08 AM
Im definately considering it, Rocky loves smaller dogs and larger as long as they are girls :love: He is nuetered every one!!! since six months!!! but still romantic! the problem is that its against our bi laws to have two dogs. I could possibly put another dog on in my daughters name but its a pretty drastic step considering that the other dog would then be subjected to Rockys limited life style. Did you guys get another pit bull? f course they are the ones that need the home the most, but I can't physically deal with two high energy dogs, Rockys a handful to walk now. Also there are financial considerations. I really appreciate you guys who are being so supportive financially and emotionally to all of us going through this!!!For Kayla and me, my neighbors suck too! I am surrounded by parks, same situation with alot of the owners. The condo next door to me just passed a bi law
BANNING PIT BULLS from thier building! They grandfathered two existing ones providing they dont create any problems! :yuck: The one pit is aggressive to other dogs because she was brought up on a farm and not socialised properly but the owner is very responsible with her and her dog is very good with people.

Copper'sMom
April 25th, 2005, 11:28 AM
Rocky is more than welcome to come and stay at my house!!! lol

You could always dress him up every time you take him out. Put a disguise on him so know one will know what breed he is -- as long as you don't mind people thinking you're a quack! I've considered this but someone(my jealous family)would call the loony bin on me!! lol :crazy:

bluntman
April 25th, 2005, 11:30 AM
It doesn't really matter because even if the law is changed, how are you going to change the minds of the other dogs owners who already have it in their heads that PitBulls are killers and their dogs are at risk?

I'm changing them one at a time, With all this pit bull B.S the liberals have spread, I now take Zena everywhere with me in public and to work. Every weekend I hit the farmers markets, and flea markets. She acts like a perfect little lady, and when they say "is that a pit bull" I proudly say "YES". Then they have a hard time trying to figure out why they are banned? So I explain that Micheal Bryant is nothing more than a grandstander, and he know's absolutely nothing about dogs, and like most other liberals he does not belong in public office. After meeting there first pit bull, people walk away knowing what a looser Bryant and the rest of the liberals really are, and that's a great feeling.

By the time the law is in full effect, we will be out of the city and living in a rural setting, I allso plan on rescueing a pit from the pound, as this will be my last move untill I buy, So I can give another dog a good home with no fear of ever having to move to an appartment with 3 dogs and a cat.

babyrocky1
April 25th, 2005, 03:41 PM
I certainly agree Bluntman. I do the same thing with Rocky except I cant take him to work. Yes you can change minds one at a time if you have to, but if the person has taken the time to talk to you about your dog they are probably at least fond of dogs and have an open mind. Not always the case in Ontario these days! Most of my neighbours llike Rocky, many even LOVE him, but it only takes a few to make your life miserable. We are too vulnerable with this law to take any chances to not comply in urban areas. When Im in the parks with my dog hundreds of condo owners can see us out thier windows. I cant think of anywhere I could go that is secluded enough that I would feel safe to have him run without the muzzle. I go out at one in the am now and still run into alot of people. Im really glad to see you will be able to provide a great home for another pittie!!! :thumbs up

babyrocky1
April 25th, 2005, 03:45 PM
No Coppers mom, you cant have ALL the cute pups!!!! One way or another Rocky stays with meLOL We'll gladly visit though!!! :crazy:

Dukieboy
April 26th, 2005, 08:22 AM
Ok, for those who live in Toronto with pitties, I know the Humane Society has enclosed dog runs behind thier building. I think they have at least four. I wonder if after the legislation goes into effect we could ask to use them individually, in the off hours perhaps for a small fee when the volunteers/staff aren't out with the Humanes dogs?

babyrocky1
April 26th, 2005, 10:03 AM
Excellent idea Dukie Boy, I asked the Toronto Pound lady that already and she said no, but the humane society mght feel differently! I'll get on it today if I can!

Dukieboy
April 26th, 2005, 11:02 AM
That would be great. I am going to work on an email but I am going to wait. I feel terrible for the dogs that are at the Humane right now and it might be to much for the staff to bear seeing pitbulls with owners and knowing the fate of the ones in thier care. But I think if they offered the option to some of the people turning in thier pitbulls it could help. I think knowing you had the support of the humane and somewhere safe to excercise him/her it may help change a persons mind. I have a small backyard so essentially, there will be no place where Duke could really have a good run. The other idea I had was there is this vacant piece of property near my house that is fenced. It has been for sale for a long time. Not that any of us could buy it but we may be able to lease it pending sale? Have a sign up sheet or something so everyone got time. One more idea, maybe we could lobby the City, Animal Services to assist? I mean really, there are at least 1000 registered pitties in the City. What kind of mess is that? 1000 unexercised, depressed, socially isolated pitties?

babyrocky1
April 26th, 2005, 12:55 PM
You could be right about waiting Dukie Boy, but what your saying about the land is the kind of thing that Ive been wondering about as well. Anyone that would rent us land mmight be worried about liability issues, but its certainly worth looking into. I was also thinking that with the large list of humane society volunteers and contributers, maybe they could put out some communication of sorts to there supporters that we are looking for unused fenced land to use to exercise our dogs. A pitty Co op kind of thing, Im all for that! :thumbs up

Dukieboy
April 26th, 2005, 01:39 PM
Pitty Co - op Exactly!!!!

Luvmypit
April 26th, 2005, 02:39 PM
I just called a KOA camp site and because of their insurance Pit Bulls and rottis are allowed but must be muzzled. So insurance certainly will be an issue. But i wonder how off leash parks handle insurance. Right now there aren't rules as to breeds as far as I know. I guess it depends on their particular insurance company.
The KOA guy was really nice and said he loved pits and they are great dogs he just unfortunantly its an insurance issue.
BLAH BLAH BLAH

Dukieboy
April 26th, 2005, 02:42 PM
off leash parks are designated by municipalities. I think signs are posted use at your own risk. I wouldn't take Duke to an off leash anymore. Just too much b**l*****. Don't need the hassle. Nothing fun about trying to anticipate what trouble might occur. Last summer Duke was a pup. He is all growed up now and produces strong reactions in people. :sad:

When we took Duke camping last year he was always on the 30ft lead.

Kayla and Me
April 26th, 2005, 05:58 PM
Ok...here's my suggestion. Near my house, in the beaches, there is a 15' high enclosed double tennis court. Sometimes it's in use, but most often it is not. I have watched it closely. Many people with many kinds of dogs take their pets in there to let them run and to have an enclosed area to train their dogs. It's a municipal court, but there does not seem to be anyway to 'book' it. You basically take your chances when you get there. On cloudy days or cold days, there are no tennis players. 5 out of 7 days a week I go there and no one else is there. Unfortunately, even when there are others with their dogs, when they see Kayla arrive, they vacate. I need people interested in socializing their dogs who are not afraid of pitbulls. Also, in the school yard behind my house there is a fairly large enclosed area for the pre-schoolers when they are in attendance. In off hours there is no one there.

My proposal....Let's form a co-op. Even if we only meet once a week, it is still more socializing than poor kayla is getting right now. We can also use the co-op for people who are feeding RAW, to bulk purchase meat from the St. Lawrence Market or reasonable butchers or farms. Let's start working together instead of trying to deal with this on an individual basis.

Anyone interested???

Kayla and Me

babyrocky1
April 26th, 2005, 06:24 PM
Absolutely interested, the beaches is a little far for me to travel too often as Im on the t.t.c. but I would love to hook up with the dogs. My boy is really not great with new other boys, but once he has been walked together with them a few times he makes friends. Hes usually great with females. If we had a few pittie co-ops throughout the city it would be great for all of us and we have time to have the dogs socialised with each other before the ban takes place. Im in the Queen West Harbourfront area, and I think some of you go to the same vet as I do. The receptionist there is going through this same problem, she has two, so Im pretty sure she would want to join us and would have contacts for more people.

Kayla and Me
April 26th, 2005, 07:18 PM
Absolutely interested, the beaches is a little far for me to travel too often as Im on the t.t.c. but I would love to hook up with the dogs. My boy is really not great with new other boys, but once he has been walked together with them a few times he makes friends. Hes usually great with females. If we had a few pittie co-ops throughout the city it would be great for all of us and we have time to have the dogs socialised with each other before the ban takes place. Im in the Queen West Harbourfront area, and I think some of you go to the same vet as I do. The receptionist there is going through this same problem, she has two, so Im pretty sure she would want to join us and would have contacts for more people.

GREAT! Kayla is a female, so I don't think she would have any problems playing with a male..LOL

Contact me offline, and we can set up the first official pitty co-op. :)

Kayla and Me

Dukieboy
April 27th, 2005, 07:57 AM
Hey guys!
I only have access to the internet during the day so I missed the convo last night. I am totally interested. As I am sure you know, Duke is male but I think because he was neutered so young he doesn't do any of the male posturing or aggressing. The little one, Wizard is another story. I didn't get him till he was 8 mos. and he wasn't neutered, he is now but... he is not always friendly when he meets new dogs so I worry about him. Anyway, I'm rambling on here What I am interested in is a place where Duke in particular can run around, safely, off leash but not with a group of dogs. I like the idea of leashed walks with other dogs though. So count me in. Babyrocky, we do have the same vet. I could walk Duke to the beaches area but I think by the time we got there he would be too tuckered to run around LOL. I think my best option would be to approach the Humane after the legislation is said and done about using one of thier dog runs occassionally.

babyrocky1
April 27th, 2005, 09:49 AM
Thats great Dukie Boy, it would be really good to meet up and do dog walking together, still a good form of socialization and also seek out paces that the dogs can run safely, alone or a few buddies together, but the more people we have looking for a place, especially if we have to pay for something, the easier it will be.

Jono
April 27th, 2005, 03:43 PM
Rosie loves everyone, and every dog. I can't vouch for all of them, but we will definately try to hook up when it is convenient. This is a great idea.

Jono

babyrocky1
April 27th, 2005, 03:49 PM
Great Jono, by the way I lost your phone # so ask your other half to give me a call when she has a chance and we can talk about the co-op and all the other stuff!!!
I didn't want to call in the middle of your move! ;)

Dukieboy
April 28th, 2005, 01:52 PM
Well here is the email I sent to the Humane Society. Will advise of the response.


Dear who ever will listen,

Hi,

My name is blah blah and I live in the area around the Humane Society. I have a pitbull and I am worried because there really is no safe place for him to have a good run. My back yard is a postage stamp. He has just turned a year now and while I did take him to the off leash, mostly Cherry Beach, when he was a pup last summer I no longer do this now. Not because he doesn't get on with other dogs, he does but because of the current climate of fear and hate created by Michael Bryant with his Breed Specific Legislation. I also have a Boston Terrier and they get on wonderfully. Duke is neutered and his shots are all up to date. He knows his basic commands. He is registered with the City.

Right now I am street walking him with a gentle leader. He walks well. I am afraid this constant lead walking with no place to really have a good run is unhealthy for him. I am sure there are other pitbull owners in the City with the same problem.

I was wondering if you would consider, with the impending legislaton, letting me use, occassionally, even for very short periods of time, one of your secure dog runs in the back during off hours for a small fee/donation?

Maybe this is something you could offer responsible pitbull owners after the legislation comes into effect late this summer? As you know, after the legislation comes into effect a muzzle and lead will be required at all times off private property. Pitbulls/mixes are high energy and require lots of exercise. I was also wondering if people knew this was an available resource perhaps they would stop surrendering or abandoning thier dogs?

I am hoping you can help.


Ms. Blah Blah

Schwinn
April 28th, 2005, 01:54 PM
Ms. Blah Blah

Just wondering if you're related to the Forest Hill Blah Blah's? :D

Sounds like a good letter. Let us know what happen!

.unknown.
April 28th, 2005, 06:05 PM
You know, that would be an almost excellent silent protest.

Dress your dog in a pretty happy, angelic disguise....I mean within the range of whatever your puppy will let you...


I feel for you all...I have been in situations where my dog has been "not welcome" based on how she looks and it feels so horrible because you know how great they are... especially when the dogs most of these ignorant pooheads have are the most misbehaved creatures on the planet.

grrr

:grouphug:


Many communities and cities believe that the solution to prevent severe and fatal dog attacks is to label, restrict or ban certain breeds of dogs as potentially dangerous. If the breed of dog was the primary or sole determining factor in a fatal dog attack, it would necessarily stand to reason that since there are literally millions of Rottweilers, Pit Bulls and German Shepherd Dogs in the United States, there would have to be countless more than an approximate 20 human fatalities per year.


"There is nothing to fear

except the persistent refusal to find out the truth,

the persistent refusal to analyze the causes of happenings."

Dorothy Thompson, (1894 - 1961)

babyrocky1
April 29th, 2005, 06:32 PM
"persistent refusal to find out the truth" thats pretty much sums up the problems in Ontario right now! Welcome to the post unknown :)

twodogsandacat
April 29th, 2005, 06:50 PM
"persistent refusal to find out the truth" thats pretty much sums up the problems in Ontario right now!

The truth is work. Throw something out and create the illusion that you are doing something is the Liberal mandate.

Ban pit bulls Ė ignore all the facts and refuse to implement a dog bite registry so you canít easily be disproved that the issue of safety isnít a breed specific issue.

Try and restrict Karla Homolka instead of prosecuting her for the death of her sister, which would probably put her in jail for life now that her complicity in the death is known. Unfortunately the Attorney General canít comment on cases before the court so of course the Ďfaceí value of such a move would be useless to him.

Shut down a coal fired power plant and when we need more capacity purchase it from the US. Wonder if those are coal burning US plants?

Bring in companies already charged with price gouging and falsifying energy trades to help build our new plants. Companies like Calpine that contributed to the issues that are STILL affecting California.

Move the greenbelt boundaries based on Ďscienceí. I guess the science was written on the back on the cheques made out to the Liberal party.

No the truth is too much work and to be honest it isnít required in order to get your name in the paper. We have elected the largest bunch of under achievers you could imagine. They may be dumb but they sure arenít stupid unless we catch on and catch on soon.

Today at lunch another table was talking about hydro. I let them know about Calpine and that in order to maintain service last week the voltage output was dropped. Then I said prepare for blackouts and brown outs soon as the air conditioners kick in. Hopefully they will blame the Liberals for any outage now even if itís a car hitting a transformer pole.

twodogsandacat
April 29th, 2005, 08:30 PM
TORONTO -- The McGuinty government is suffering from guilt by association, suggests a new Toronto Sun/Leger Marketing poll that shows the provincial Liberals trailing the PC Party. The poll found support for the Conservatives has increased to 37%, up four points in just a month, while the Liberals have dropped eight points to 36%. The NDP held steady at 19%.
Craig Worden, associate VP of public affairs for Leger Marketing, said the decline in provincial Liberal support can be attributed, in part, to damning Adscam testimony affecting McGuinty's political cousins. http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/OttawaSun/News/2005/04/29/1017758-sun.html

Good. As I have said before anything that the feds can do to discredit the provincial liberals is fine with me. I have no problem using peoples distaste for the federal Liberals against the provincial liberals. When it comes to Liberals my contempt is for the breed:
Provincial Liberals
Federal Liberals
Any dog, I mean party, having the characteristics of a liberal.
Should all be banned.

.unknown.
April 30th, 2005, 10:50 PM
It is really disheartening to know that, in general the whole world is more interested in blanket solutions and instant gratification. Not enough people look past the end of their own noses and realize there is a whole world around them and that they are not the most important people on the planet. I don't know what to say....I can't even know what i would do if i were in any of your situations... I would be heart broken.

I think about alot of the small dog owners i've met/know...Their dogs are little, so they don't get trained. When they beg it's cute, when they growl and snarl they get on America's Funniest Home Videos, they act like little hell beasts. As soon as any bigger dog shows any inkling of aggression - realistically or not...they are painted with the vicious brush. I can't even begin to thin of how to change a majority of people's minds about animals...I now can only lead by example and onlyhope that the people who meet my pets have their minds changed about how to treat them....

*sigh* my heart really goes out to you all.

If there is any thing i can do from Alberta let me know!!

:love:


"Many have forgotten this truth but you must not forget it.

We remain responsible forever for what we have tamed."

Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Schwinn
May 2nd, 2005, 09:33 AM
I don't think it's guilt by association. The federal liberals are actually still leading the PC's in Ontario (from the last report I heard). Nope, McGinty sucks fine on his own, apparently.

babyrocky1
May 2nd, 2005, 10:47 AM
Actually, if I remember correctly, during the last elction, (federal) McGuinty was the biggest problem the Feds had in Ontario. He had just brought in the Health tax errr premium and raised hydro costs, broke a bunch of election promises, and was leading an extremely unpopular provincial government. They did not enjoy the usual"honeymoon" that most new governments bask in for a while, untiil lets see what happened that started to change that hmmm, oh yeah ,they discovered "pit bulls" those provincial fibs, gotta hate em!!!!!! :evil:

babyrocky1
May 4th, 2005, 03:25 PM
On his way to his first date!

babyrocky1
May 4th, 2005, 03:27 PM
:love: All is well!! Pit Bull Co-op is officially a SUCCESS :thumbs up

babyrocky1
May 4th, 2005, 03:28 PM
Kayla wore Rocky out!!

twodogsandacat
May 4th, 2005, 04:53 PM
Great looking dogs both of them. Is that a bus or a subway chair?

babyrocky1
May 4th, 2005, 05:03 PM
Its the Street Car--He likes to make himself at home! It was a long ride and he has just had his sixth birthday so Kayla wore him out pretty quickly! They really enjoyed themselves though, and they were both very well behaved! Its so nice to se him allowed to play like that again. He does have a small play group in our neighborhood, but thisis the first time in a few years he has been able to meet a new friend and be able to play off leash with them!!!

twodogsandacat
May 4th, 2005, 05:23 PM
Wow, I didn't know that dogs (any dogs) other than service dogs were allowed on street cars. Pretty progressive city.

babyrocky1
May 4th, 2005, 05:29 PM
Pets are allowed on all vehicles of the TTC as long as it isn't rush hour. I just assumed they were everywhere. Not in other cities and towns?

Kayla and Me
May 4th, 2005, 09:27 PM
Great pics!!! And, a good time had by all. Kayla didn't fade til about 10pm tonight, but she hit the bed like a rock when she did. She was still chasing those imaginary squirrels for hours after her date with Rocky. I think she's going to want to sleep in tomorrow morning! :)

So nice to have a few hours of freedom with another dog without a hyper owner interfering because they are afraid your dog is going to chew the ears off their pet. Thanks for the great afternoon Rocky and Mom!

Kayla and Me

Dukieboy
May 5th, 2005, 07:59 AM
Wow!!!! Looks like they had a great time. Where did you guys go? Great pix, both are beauties!!!!

Copper'sMom
May 5th, 2005, 08:44 AM
They make a cute couple!! ;) :p Glad to hear all went well!! They are both cuties!!!

twodogsandacat
May 5th, 2005, 04:51 PM
Pets are allowed on all vehicles of the TTC as long as it isn't rush hour. I just assumed they were everywhere. Not in other cities and towns?

I have never seen a dog on one of our buses in all the years (school years) I took them with the exception of service dogs. That however doesn't confirm that there is a policy against it and their website doesn't mention it.

York Region has this policy:
Dogs on leashes and small non-exotic pets that are without danger or offence to other passengers as determined by the Bus Operator; are permitted on YRT buses except during peak periods, from 06:30 AM to 09:30 AM and from 03:30 PM to 06:30 PM Monday to Friday inclusive, during any emergency, or at any other time that vehicles are heavily loaded. Bus operators have the right to reject the boarding of any animal, which they feel poses a threat to other passengers.

Kudos to the transit authority in TO and kudos to both of you for your efforts to maintain the quality of your dogs life.

Kayla and Me
May 5th, 2005, 08:27 PM
Wow!!!! Looks like they had a great time. Where did you guys go? Great pix, both are beauties!!!!


We think so too. :)

Took them to a large double tennis court with 10' high fencing (enclosed). Great place to let them loose, and long as you don't go when people are playing tennis. Lots of neighbourhood dogs go there for their 'run', during the off hours. We lucked out and had the place to ourselves. No one there during the afternoons.

Kayla and Me

pitbulliest
May 7th, 2005, 12:55 AM
Awww..I wanna meet up I wanna meet up next! ME ME OOHH ME ME NEXT ME NEXT!!! :D

lol

babyrocky1
May 9th, 2005, 09:25 AM
Hi Pitbulliest, welcome to the first ever Pitbull Co-op! :thumbs up

babyrocky1
May 12th, 2005, 01:38 PM
Hi everyone, Im updating this thread cause people have been asking about the Pit bull co-op so rather than summarizing whats gone on in a new thread I thought Id try it this way. Im glad to see that people are interested in doing this and I think if we get the word out to others who may have pit bulls and are going through the same thing that we could build a very strong group and have lots of creative ideas on how to maintain the quality of our dogs lives through this ban, even on the way home from Rockys date with Kayla a woman approached us and asked how we would cope as she had a pit bull of her own. I gave her my business card and told her about this site and what we are trying to do. That is about the only positive thing that I have found since this all started, although many people have been horrible to us when we are out, I also meet alot of nice people, and alot of people in the same boat. If we can obtain land we could also do things like have trainers come in and help us out with whatever issues might be concerning us or just help us train them to do something fun! Rocky would like it if we could do bulk buying of those Jumbo Kongs lol! Anyways lots of possibilities when we stick together. Pitbulliest, I think it might be illegal to assassinate someone, voting them out of office-no problem :thumbs up

Luvmypit
May 12th, 2005, 03:58 PM
Sounds like a Great idea to me. Im in!

pitbulliest
May 15th, 2005, 11:18 AM
lol I was joking..

geez do you people see me as that much of a psychopath? lol :o

babyrocky1
May 15th, 2005, 04:19 PM
Sorry Pitbyulliest, meant to put the LOL along with that post! LOL tee heee heee!

babyrocky1
May 18th, 2005, 06:01 PM
Hi everyone, Luvmypit and I thought it would be a good idea to add Pit Bull Co-op to the title of this thread, that way people that dont know how this came about can read the initial conversations and understand were we are coming from. Also the title is now more descriptive for new people who might want to join in. So far we have Me, Kayla and me, Luvmypit, Pitbulliest ,Dukie boy, and Jono on occasion. Am I forgetting anyone? Anyway we are all in Toronto, but maybe people could start these groups up outside of the city as well. I guess its not as necessary for those of you with land, but friends are very much needed when we are about to go through something so traumatic for ourselves and our dogs! So now we can have a space to discuss our plans, and others can join in the discussions or the co-op. :)

Kayla and Me
May 18th, 2005, 11:29 PM
Well, here is where Kayla and Me are right now. I just put up a 5' -$1500.00 fence around my postage stamp property, and the minute I let Kayla out to explore her new play area, it took her about 3 mins. to figure out she could jump the fence or dig her way under it, or burrow under the deck and connect with the neighbours and make her escape that way. Needless to say, I'm beside myself.

This boils down to, going back to the tennis court and bringing other pitbulls to the group to socialize with Kayla.

When to we want to have the next PITTIE CO-OP meeting and where?

A very frustrated...Kayla and Me

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 08:18 AM
Hi guys! I have been off the board for a while. I had a terrible incident with Duke and a crazed jogger on the Don Walkway. He had his dog off leash and I told him he should leash his dog because the dog walked right up to Duke and it should have been obvious that the interaction wasn't welcome. I had sat Duke on the grass just off the path and was standing between him and the oncomers. The guy went nuts, he asked why he should have to leash his dog(its the law?)who wasn't a vicious pitbull. He called me a c**t and asked me if I wanted him to spit on me. You can imagine Duke is barking by now, then the guy starts flexing his hand with a leather leash in it. At that point I said ok, I'm calling the police. He said "go ahead" but did start to move on. The incident totally freaked me out. I haven't been able to bring myself to take him down there again and I am really nervous even street walking him now. Its getting better but it is going to take time to get over it and I sure hope I am not faced with another incident in the near future. Don't think I could cope.
What do you guys think about the idea of meeting up to chat without the dogs first?

Kayla and me: Why don't you buy a tie out for the yard?

Finally, I haven't heard back from the Humane. I am starting to think you can bring your dogs in off hours but they don't want to say you can because of liability.?

Kayla and Me
May 19th, 2005, 09:55 AM
Hi guys! I have been off the board for a while. I had a terrible incident with Duke and a crazed jogger on the Don Walkway. He had his dog off leash and I told him he should leash his dog because the dog walked right up to Duke and it should have been obvious that the interaction wasn't welcome. I had sat Duke on the grass just off the path and was standing between him and the oncomers. The guy went nuts, he asked why he should have to leash his dog(its the law?)who wasn't a vicious pitbull. He called me a c**t and asked me if I wanted him to spit on me. You can imagine Duke is barking by now, then the guy starts flexing his hand with a leather leash in it. At that point I said ok, I'm calling the police. He said "go ahead" but did start to move on. The incident totally freaked me out. I haven't been able to bring myself to take him down there again and I am really nervous even street walking him now. Its getting better but it is going to take time to get over it and I sure hope I am not faced with another incident in the near future. Don't think I could cope.
What do you guys think about the idea of meeting up to chat without the dogs first?

Kayla and me: Why don't you buy a tie out for the yard?

Finally, I haven't heard back from the Humane. I am starting to think you can bring your dogs in off hours but they don't want to say you can because of liability.?


Wow! Scary. There are some pathetic nutcases out there.

What is a tie-out? If it means that she gets tied to a rope again, then what's the point of fencing the yard..LOL

As for meeting without the dogs....Count me in. When would you like to do this?

Kayla and Me

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 11:09 AM
A tie out is ya, tied up. :sad:

Anybody for a Saturday meeting just to talk about our dogs and where we are at with this whole thing, compare experiences and try and generate some solutions? If not Sat, suggest an alternative. I know it sounds silly,without the dogs but we can't all meet up with the dogs, I think that would be chaos. ??

Luvmypit
May 19th, 2005, 11:15 AM
Dukie Sorry you had to go through that...
I would have kicked his.... I would have spit at him right in his face after he said that.... Do you want me to spit on you? Arggghhhh... I cant even believe people....

please report incident to goodpooch.com

As for when we are gonna meet up.. Im not available this weekend but next weekend I am! I'll have to check with capone ofcourse... hee hee j/k

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 12:14 PM
Thx Luvmypit. Next weekend is fine for me, anybody else?

Kayla and Me
May 19th, 2005, 12:44 PM
Thx Luvmypit. Next weekend is fine for me, anybody else?


I'm good for this Saturday or Monday. Next weekend is out for me unfortunately. I'm also available in the evenings, if that is any easier.

Kayla and Me

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 12:59 PM
evenings are ok for me but must be brief cuz dogs are home alone for most of the day. Babyrocky? Luvmypit? Pittbulliest? Anyone else?

Copper'sMom
May 19th, 2005, 01:17 PM
Dukieboy, I'm sorry to hear of your incident! That is horrible. I don't understand how people can be so ignorant to each other!

Glad to hear you and Dukie are ok!

Luvmypit
May 19th, 2005, 01:19 PM
Im good with evenings just need some notice... And I will be there. I love this idea!

Kayla and Me
May 19th, 2005, 01:20 PM
evenings are ok for me but must be brief cuz dogs are home alone for most of the day. Babyrocky? Luvmypit? Pittbulliest? Anyone else?

Agreed. So lets stick to the weekends. At least if we decide to bring the dogs, they can travel on the TTC (for us non car people). I can try to free up next Saturday, May 28th in the morning if that will work. So far, there are two that can meet on that weekend. I will be the third.

K and M

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 01:33 PM
ok, Sat May 28th am looks good, we will just have to see when the others come on line.



thx Coppersmom.

Kayla and Me
May 19th, 2005, 02:19 PM
ok, Sat May 28th am looks good, we will just have to see when the others come on line.



thx Coppersmom.


Great. Ok...lets pick a location and then the others will have all the details.

Kayla and Me
May 19th, 2005, 02:19 PM
Great. Ok...lets pick a location and then the others will have all the details.


I live in the Beaches area.

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 02:42 PM
I live in the Beaches area.
I am just a short street car ride away. Beaches sounds good to me. We could grab a coffee and sit in the park? If its a nice day.

anyone else?

More people come on line at night and I have no access to the internet at home so I will check tommorow am.

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 02:47 PM
I think we have to make an exception for Copper cuz I don't think his Mom can leave him alone. So we will all get to meet Copper at our first meet.

later:

I just noticed Copper is in Simcoe.

Luvmypit
May 19th, 2005, 02:52 PM
so first time we are gonna go just humans only...

Maybe and this is just a weird idea but if everyone brings a peice of something that their dog has his/her scent on enough for each of us that go so that we can all bring home a peice of each dog they are about to meet.
Maybe get them used to their scents first.

I don't know it may cause them to be more aggresive but I know this is something you can do when introducing a new dog or even baby into the family..

Just an idea.... Like a clothe I can leave with capone for a week or so and then split up the clothe so each person can bring it home to their dog and get used to the scent and then when they meet they will be somewhat familiar and more comfortable...
I don't know if this would help but you never know...

Copper'sMom
May 19th, 2005, 02:53 PM
Oh someday soon i hope to meet you all!!! And i can always get a sitter for Copper :love:. Weekends are good for me but not until July(i think). I've got a temp. part time job for weekends but only till the busy gardening season is up!

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 03:00 PM
Luvmypit: I think that is an excellent idea. I just thought humans only would give us the opportunity to talk about what our dogs are like, where they are at with training and how they relate to other doggies. Get our introductions out of the way and then we can focus on the dogs when they meet. :)

Coppersmom, we will look forward to meeting you in July.

Dukieboy
May 19th, 2005, 03:05 PM
Hopefully Pitbulliest and Rockysmom will catch up on the thread tonight. I will be back tommorow.

babyrocky1
May 19th, 2005, 04:33 PM
Hi everyone, by next weekend do you mean this Saturday, if so evening is better for me and if you would like we can meet at my place. I'm at Harbourfront, which I think is sort of in the middle for everyone, actually any eve this wkend is fine, but next weekend is my daughters birthday! I'm so sorry about what happened to you Dukie boy!

babyrocky1
May 19th, 2005, 04:44 PM
Im sorry, Ididnt go back far enough! Saturday May 28th is only okay for me if you guys can come here cause I have to take care of Rocky and then baby sit for Brandon so it will take me too long to get there and back. I work nights so I cant do mornings. Kayla and me, weekdays are still good for play dates, Wednesday works well! Do people have any free afternoons or evenings this wkend?

Dukieboy
May 20th, 2005, 07:42 AM
Oops, I called you Rockysmom instead of BabyRocky ;)

I am close to Harbourfront as well so meeting there would be fine for me. How about others? Pls post.

babyrocky1
May 20th, 2005, 10:21 AM
I was talking to Kaylas mom last night and she cant make it here May 28th, she is only available in the am and I am not so if we cant think of any other time that everyone can make it, I guess Il lhave to sit this one out as it looks like yu all can do May 28th in the am in the beaches. I would love to meet you all as soon as possible but my schedule is tough to work around right now cause I dont actually have a day off until the end of June, exept for this long weekend. Thats why I was hoping to do it this weekend. My other alternatives would be a weeknight,I can take an evening off work or weekend evenings. I have four commissions do in the next few weeks so Im really stressed for time, but on the other hand when Im working at home, if you guys can come here, I can always take some time out. I guess the next alternative would be to start the doggy introductions so that way we only need to worry about two at a time to coordinate schedules, once the summer time comes Im really flexible! Dukie boy, I know you are not available during the weekdays, Whatabout you Luvmypit? Do you ever have a wkday off? And I called Pitbulliest and left her a message to read the post, I have no idea whata her schedule is. I hope Ididnt just confuse things more!!!! Ill try to be back n lne from work tonight!

Dukieboy
May 27th, 2005, 07:53 AM
Okay so where are we at? Is anyone available Sat am for coffee?

LavenderRott
May 27th, 2005, 08:30 AM
I wanted to post this in an active thread so that you guys would read it. Please bear in mind that this woman may well lose her dog because she did not register it. I know that the whole thing is a crappy law and there is much work going on behind the scenes to fight it, but until it is overturned, protect your dogs by following the law.

GUYSBOROUGH, N.S. Ė A woman is pleading with Guysborough County
> officials to let her keep her beloved pit bull despite a ban on
the
> breed.
>
> Marilyn Cameron has had her dog Zeus for 13 years. When the bylaw
> banning the breed was introduced 10 years ago, she failed to
> register her pet.
>
> Now bylaw enforcement officials with the Municipality of the
> District of Guysborough say she has to give up her dog.
>
> But Cameron says they better be ready for a fight.
>
> "I asked my husband to lock the door and come pick me up at work.
> And I'll go to jail, because this dog is not leaving this yard.
>
> "If this dog had done something wrong, yes. But this dog, all he
> done is love a family and he greets everybody with a kiss when
they
> come in."
>
> Municipal warden Lloyd Hines says there's not much council can do.
> If Zeus had been registered, he says council may have been able to
> help.
>
> "That would have provided an opportunity to deal with existing
> animals at that time. But that didn't occur, we weren't aware of
the
> dog because it wasn't registered with us."
>
> Cameron insists she was unaware of the bylaw or the need to
register
> any of her dogs, and blames officials for not notifying people.
>
> Council will deal with the issue Wednesday. Cameron plans to be
> there to plead Zeus's case.

Dukieboy
May 27th, 2005, 09:16 AM
Thanks. I agree, it is crucial that everyone has thier dog registered with the Municipality they live in. I think that if you can demonstrate that you owned your dog prior to the ban with vet records your dog is grandfathered.

Kayla and Me
May 27th, 2005, 09:18 AM
Okay so where are we at? Is anyone available Sat am for coffee?

Sorry Dukieboy, I have to bail on the meeting now. I will be at the airport tomorrow morning picking up family. The original plans for the pick up fell through and it is now getting dumped on me. :(

I'll have to catch up later too.

Kayla and Me

Daisy's Owner
May 27th, 2005, 09:18 AM
Municipal warden Lloyd Hines says there's not much council can do. If Zeus had been registered, he says council may have been able to
> help.


Actually. If Zeus had been registered, Zeus would have been removed from the county ten years ago when the by-law was introduced. There is no grandfather clause on pitbulls, only Rottweillers.

And further to this. Any dog in the county can be impounded if not registered. I don't see the county impounding other unregistered dogs.

http://www.modg.ca/pdfs/by-law13.PDF

Dukieboy
May 27th, 2005, 09:19 AM
good point Angela.

Dukieboy
May 27th, 2005, 09:20 AM
Sorry Dukieboy, I have to bail on the meeting now. I will be at the airport tomorrow morning picking up family. The original plans for the pick up fell through and it is now getting dumped on me. :(

I'll have to catch up later too.

Kayla and Me

Ok, we will all have to try and organize at a later date.

babyrocky1
May 27th, 2005, 04:52 PM
Hey everyone, I typed something about registration on another thread, but yeah were getting close, A long while ago I posted that I had spoken to Elitta Purdy< I think she is the manager of the city pounds. She seems sympathetic to us but will obviously will uphold the law. She is the person who told me that Toronto is looking at all sort of bilaws but the over all intent is not breed specific. Anyway in regards to registration she told me that no matter what my vet records say, and they say that Rocky is an American Bull dog cross, that if they think he looks like a pit bull , that is how he will be registered ,and after reading the Jen Steele posts, maybe that is best. I am hoping that the fact that I have not admitted that he is a pit bull ;and that they are the ones saying he is, that if we win the reverse onus clause, I will not have said that he is a pit bull, putting the burden of proof back on the state. Thats my thinking but hey Im an artist, not a lawyer. BUT for anyone thinking of not registering their Alleged pits, I think thats the most dangerous thing to do and thankyou Lavender Rot for the post!

babyrocky1
May 27th, 2005, 05:09 PM
Re Pitty Co-op, well I had to cancel Rockys date with Kayla cause I was sick as a DOG! It looks like we havent gotten to far with plans thhis week. I am working on four commissions from hell and have very little time, but I will try and hook up with you guys and as I said before, you are all welcome at my place, I thought you were doing Sat. a m which I couldn't make or I would have made plans earlier. At this point though, its better for me if things are spontanious, If the weather is good I have to go out and sell my commissions, if its bad I can stay home. Also on the weekends there is a fenced back yard right on the water that we can use. Its the backyard to a city office but they have told me I can be there with my boy. I have had a pm from Pitbulliest, she is really busy for the next few weeks as well, but still on board. Dukie boy Ive probably missed you again as I dont think your on-line on the weekends, but if you happen to see this, give me a call and maybe we can find some time for a dog walk at least, I hope your feeling better after your ordeal, if your nervouse we can come and get you. You too Luvmypit, give me a call, Iknow your further away, but maybe we can meet somewhere. Im really getting scared now, my big plan for Rockys exercise was roller blading with him and to that end Ive been trying to get him used to the trail, yesterday I had to take a dive twice as bladers coming from the opposite direction flipped him out! That bike trail is REALLY busy and will nonly get worse! Its actually getting stressful for the humans! Im now thinking of getting one of those three wheeler bicicles, No Snickering please! Im sure he would pull me over with a regualar bike since Ive never tried riding with him. Anyone got any other suggestions?

babyrocky1
June 8th, 2005, 09:42 PM
Hey everyone, well it looks like everyones been busy with woofstock and all. Im stiill in a really stressful place with my commissions but also still very committed to doing this, I recently met someone in my neighborhood with a young male nuetered pit. we got them together for a walk. At first they snarled at each other a bit as they were smelling each others buts so we immediatley just started walking them parrallell and all was fine. We walked without any stress for a good half an hour. This has made me feel much more confident in meeting you guys with males. I think the walking first is the best way to go. Rocky has also made some new large breed male friends that he liked immediately so his socialization is going quite well and Id like to keep up that momentum. I also talked again to the guy form the city who is in charge of the fenced yard and he reassured me that it its fine to use it. Things will be much easier for me in July so I hope we can get together soon. I hope everyone had a good time at Woofstock :thumbs up

Dukieboy
June 9th, 2005, 07:58 AM
Hey guys!!

Babyrocky, yea I am still nervous but still interested. It would be great if we could meet up half way or something. What is the fenced yard you are talking about? Where is it?
re: Bikepath, I prefer to call it the "walkway" because it isn't just for cyclists although you would never know that by the way a lot of them behave. Several times they have rode past way way to close to Duke and at very high speeds. Don't go there anymore. Can't afford for him to have more bad experiences. Street walk him mostly now.

babyrocky1
June 9th, 2005, 07:24 PM
There is an old building by the malting plant right near where I live, the city work trucks park there and there is a guy who 'watches the building, the back yard of this small building is fenced and right on the lake. This is where I take Rocky for Kong playing, its really scary at night YIKES but not as scary as him not getting exercised, poor guy! Actually he hates this heat so he just lies around til night fall anyway. Id be happy to meet you half way or wherever is convenient. Same for the rest of you pittie co-operators. The next ten days or so are still bad as I have to sell all my commissions for the summer before then, but after that Ill havae more flex time. Have you tried out the Humane Society dog run yet?

Schwinn
June 9th, 2005, 08:56 PM
I'd like to join in, but we're nervous about Daisy. She's been aggressive on the leash with other dogs. Not too many problems off the leash, but it's made us nervous around new dogs (and people!)

mona_b
June 9th, 2005, 09:28 PM
There is no grandfather clause on pitbulls,

And further to this. Any dog in the county can be impounded if not registered. I don't see the county impounding other unregistered dogs.

http://www.modg.ca/pdfs/by-law13.PDF

Actually yes there is on this upcomming ban.

As for not impounding other unregistered(unlicenced) dogs,actually they can or else you will be fined if I recal $120

I have posted this on another thread.But I will post it here.

http://www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.ca/english/about/pubs/dola-pubsfty/dola-pubsfty.asp#TOC_03

babyrocky1
June 9th, 2005, 10:19 PM
I think Daisys owner is talking about one of the places in Nova Scotia, not Ontario. There is definately grandfathering in Ontario with the Provincial ban, however, there are lots of problems ex Jen Steeles dog, Lily, and Taco in Windsor, etc. etc. with municipal bans already in place. As far as Ontario goes we need to comply with the registration because if we miss the date well, that could be unthinkable! I am really concerned with people thinking that the ban won't effect them, we really don't know how far it will go in its reach considering a dog only need "resemble a pit bull" to be included in the ban!

Luvmypit
June 10th, 2005, 02:17 PM
Hi guys Im moving in three weeks so I am out for a while. Not to mention a friends shower, mothers bday, fathers day and moving all within 3 weeks. I will be available after July 23rd. As July I have a wedding, bacherlorette to plan and all kinds of stuff. Im a maid of honour in a wedding which I didn't realize was so much work.

I will keep watching your correspondance during my available time to see if I can join ya!

Dukieboy
June 10th, 2005, 02:33 PM
I don't think registration has anything to do with it. I think you just have to be able to prove ownership which can be done with vet records.

babyrocky1
June 10th, 2005, 05:38 PM
Maybe so Dukie boy, but it is illegal not to register your dog, any dog, and Rocky isn't registered yet, but he will be very shortly. just got him micro-chipped so I can prove he is HIM, but the vet records themselves couldn't prove for absolutely sure that your dog is the same dog, Our vet has the dogs picture right on the invoice, I just don't think anything should be left up to anyone in the buerocratic or political realm where theres any sort of judgement call required. I just re-read the leg again and no it does not call for registration, but the city does, and it refers to obeying the municiapl laws, so to me the safest thing is still register the dog, I hope Im not making a mistake, cause they will register him as a pit bull. We actually need a legal opinion now, thats what so scary! What are you all doing registering or not registering and if you are registering will you be trying to register as something other than a 'pit bull"

babyrocky1
June 10th, 2005, 05:45 PM
I'd like to join in, but we're nervous about Daisy. She's been aggressive on the leash with other dogs. Not too many problems off the leash, but it's made us nervous around new dogs (and people!)
Hey Schwinn, Rocky is very charming with the girls, maybe she would like him! He would :love: her!

Dukieboy
June 13th, 2005, 08:57 AM
Duke is registered. I looked at muzzles on the weekend. Have you guys started getting your dogs accustomed yet? I think I am going to get the cage type. I saw one with very soft leather for the head straps. I wonder how other dogs react to dogs with a muzzle on?

Does micro chipping hurt? I had Wizard done while he was under being neutered but I haven't had Duke done yet, so does it hurt if they are awake?

Kayla and Me
June 15th, 2005, 01:31 PM
Duke is registered. I looked at muzzles on the weekend. Have you guys started getting your dogs accustomed yet? I think I am going to get the cage type. I saw one with very soft leather for the head straps. I wonder how other dogs react to dogs with a muzzle on?

Does micro chipping hurt? I had Wizard done while he was under being neutered but I haven't had Duke done yet, so does it hurt if they are awake?

Dukieboy, Can the cage muzzles be used with a halty? Kayla will walk with the nylon muzzle but manages to pull it off within a few mins. It's also dangerous in the hot summer months. Hard for her to drink with it on. Was thinking of getting the cage one too, but have to do a little investigation. Kayla can not use a collar and leash when walking because she had throat damage when she was a pup and chokes on a collar. She is too strong for me in a body harness, so I'm stuck with the halty. Just trying to find the 'right' muzzle to go with a halty.

Kayla and Me

babyrocky1
June 15th, 2005, 04:19 PM
Hi guys, I am a big suck and did not watch Rocky get his micro-chip done , but he was out in seconds, and not at all traumatised! Kayla and me, if you cant do the halti with the cage muzzle, maybe you could try that harness that I have for Rocky, I cant remember what its called, but as you know I LOVE it! It doesn't stop him pulling all together , but it is much better than anything else I have tried, it might be called a sporn harness, but Ill find out for you if you like. Im still on dead llines, but bythe time the long weekend is in July Ill have some flex time and would love to do some Pit bull coop socialising! Oh, and Dukie boy, where did you seee the cage muzzle, I would like to at least see one before purchasing, in reality that is, not just on-line.

rottndakota
June 16th, 2005, 12:22 AM
Hi everyone,my name is Leeann.I own one rescue yellow lab and a 20 month old rottie twerp.I am here as myself and not as the president of the DLCC.

I am working with the Cameron family and their law firm to provide them all the help they are going to need in the next little while.Let me tell you,these are very special people.

I hope no one takes offense if I post their story and the request for financial help to fight this man Hines.

It may give you an idea of what my council is doing to help out as many owners as we can.We cannot help everyone,but we are trying.

If it is okay with you all then I will give you the details on how we are working with them .It isnt just their dog Zeus at risk of death,it is also a 9month old hound mix the ACO has labeled as a pit bull.

I hope this meets with your approval.

Lee

babyrocky1
June 16th, 2005, 06:22 PM
Hi Leeann and welcome to the BSL forum, I have updated the Skip Guysborough Nova Scotia thread which is about their BSL and also has alot of information about Zuess and his family, I hope this helps. :)

rottndakota
June 17th, 2005, 12:38 AM
Thanks for keeping people up to date on Guysborough.To date they have about 125 dollars in the legal fund.

Now I think,if I may clarify a few points about Bill 132 and why the DLCC and other organizations have banned together.

Fighting this is Bill 132 is on behalf of all the dogs right across CANADA.In Ontario,court challenges such as ours will go down as case law.Case law builds other cases credibility.We are not prepared to back down and we will take it as far as it needs to go for us to win.During this trial,there will be admitted as evidence for the first time in Canada verifiable proof, witnesses, research and expert testimonies that will help every fighting against BSL in Canada.WHEN we win in Ontario,we are moving to other areas as well.I personally have two spots here in my province that require a good fight.

The DLCC STRONGLY believes that for far too long,dog owners have never come together in such a manner.The DLCC does not discriminate against any breed or mix thereof.We believe in the law upholding the rights of responsible dog owners while addressing the issue not based on breed but by behaviors of the dog and owner.

Can you all imagine when dog owners join as one team against politicians and law makers to stop the death of innocent dogs and punitive measures against repsonsible dog owners?

That is why we decided to work together and drop our minor differences.

We need everyone.

Dukieboy
June 17th, 2005, 08:56 AM
Hi everyone,

I have been away for a couple of days.

Babyrocky;

I saw the muzzle at a pet store just east of Broadview on the south side of Queen. I think it was about 40.00.

babyrocky1
June 17th, 2005, 04:29 PM
Thanks Dukie Boy, is that what your goig to get?

Melinda
June 17th, 2005, 05:42 PM
Probably butting in here where I don't belong, I don't own a pit bull and have nothing against the breed, only of certain owners, but I think you guys should try calling groomers, trainers and vets. My trainer has an enclosed pasture for free dog play that she rents out by the 1/2 hour or full hour for your dog to run free and she also has another with agility equipment set up, her costs run $15. per 1/2 hour or 20. for a full hour, I'm in Cornwall and we all think its a great idea, maybe there are some like that where you could all meet? She is a proud owner of 3 pit bulls and takes them to senior homes to visit, the seniors just love them!!

babyrocky1
June 17th, 2005, 06:06 PM
Probably butting in here where I don't belong, I don't own a pit bull and have nothing against the breed, only of certain owners, but I think you guys should try calling groomers, trainers and vets. My trainer has an enclosed pasture for free dog play that she rents out by the 1/2 hour or full hour for your dog to run free and she also has another with agility equipment set up, her costs run $15. per 1/2 hour or 20. for a full hour, I'm in Cornwall and we all think its a great idea, maybe there are some like that where you could all meet? She is a proud owner of 3 pit bulls and takes them to senior homes to visit, the seniors just love them!!
Excellent idea Melinda and thanks for "butting in" Actually us 'pit bull type dog owners' love helpful advice from other folks, If trainers are not doing that kind of thing now, and I dont think they are in Toronto, then they may well be once the ban is enacted and the old supply and demand thing comes into play. Money often motivates people, but it would be better if we could find, as a group, some free space, My dog is used to playing off leash once or twice a day so exercise after the ban will definately be somewhat curtailed.

rottndakota
June 17th, 2005, 10:46 PM
One of our most treasured members just called me.He and another friend in Toronto were walking their dogs,"pit bull" and stopped to have a chat and smoke alongside their cars.OPP officers sat in their car and watched them for over half an hour.

We are collecting verified stories of threats and harm done to "pit bull" and "pit bull like" dogs in Ontario and I am becoming very alarmed at the steady increase.

Watch over your dogs and be very careful in off leash parks where your dog may not be seen by you at all times.

As for muzzles,there is a small company waiting for copy right to go through that are producing a humane muzzle of varying sizes that has a built in gentlle leader.The price in bulk will be about 35% less than shelf price and I have asked if the DLCC can place an order and sell them at cost to our members and non members alike.

Keep fingers crossed that they get copy right as I have two here ,one for my Lucca and another for a friends fila.They are excellant and have three areas for sizing and fitting properly.

The two guys who created this wish to remain anonymous until the product is passed.

I HATE the idea of having to muzzle any good dog.Please pray we win.

twodogsandacat
June 18th, 2005, 06:47 AM
I HATE the idea of having to muzzle any good dog.Please pray we win.


WE WILL WIN....

waldo
June 19th, 2005, 12:29 AM
I have been reading posts in this site for over an hour now. I feel sorry for all you Pit Bull owners. It looks most, if not all of you are responsible dog owners. I would not like to have to do things to and with my dogs that you people are going to have to do. I don't have to do it with my dogs because when I picked them I used good judgement in choosing there breed. If you people had done this, you would not be faced with the problems you now have. Before you all get started I have heard it all before, The pit bull is the most eager to please it's master, The pit bull is the most loyal, the pit bull is intelligent and the pit bull is not people agressive. I almost forgot other dogs bite too. The ban is here because it is needed. Not all and probably most pit owners are not responsible dog owners. You may not admit it but I am sure you all know it is the most dangerous dog out there. The breeding that went into it has seen to that. Of all the dogs you could have owned why a pit? I already know why and now you and your dogs are going to suffer for your bad judgement. Almost if not all breeds have all the qualities you people claim to love about your pit bulls with-out inbred desire to fight, so why did you choose a Pit? Unless you use it for pulling contests, I will assume (and probably correctly) that you chose it for it's rep. Stop fighting this ban! The rest of us are scarred to death of having a bad incounter with a pit bull. Not because of all the media hype but because if it happens there is little or nothing we can do to stop one of these dogs and when it does happen it is usually horibble. How many children have to have there faces ripped apart or killed? Yes these things will still happen with other breeds but not as often or as savagely as with you'rs. Responsible pit bull owners are not the majority! There are far too many of these dogs on the wrong hands. Obey the laws, take care of and love your dogs untill they pass on and the next time you go out to pick a dog use good judgement, pick a breed that is not potentionally dangerous. Believe it or not we will all be a lot safer and happier.

Sneaky2006
June 19th, 2005, 12:44 AM
I feel sorry for all you Pit Bull owners. Please, don't.
I feel sorry for YOU for only being able to read what you want to see. I am going to feel even more sorry for you once the other members see your post. Good luck.

Faceless
June 19th, 2005, 11:17 AM
Where's Waldo? Probably sitting around the family table, talking about how great Michael Bryant, Dalton McGuinty and the Fiberal party are. If he isn't already in their paid employ.

What an ill-informed, silly opinion. The majority of pit-bull owners are responsible; With 20,000+ pit-bull type dogs in the GTA, and only 12 incidents last year, I would say they're more responsible than most. And with less pit-bull related deaths in the past 20+ years than Husky-breeds (just one example.) Ban Huskies! Ban Alaskan Malamutes! They're killing machines!

Some people obviously will never learn. Especially when the next dog breed has replaced the Pit as the media scapegoat. Hey, we should all buy Dashchunds! Only problem is, they've killed children too.

Hey, Maybe ALL DOG BREEDS SHOULD BE BANNED? Great idea, who has Bryant's phone number?

twodogsandacat
June 19th, 2005, 06:39 PM
the next time you go out to pick a dog use good judgement, .

Actually the next time we pick a government we will use better judgement that you can be sure of. As for all your comments they are so full of it and obviously unresearched other than headlines that I can only believe that you are baiting....in which case I suggest you go take a walk as I can't believe that you have nothing better to do...wait....I can.

I used to believe all that crap to until I researched and met some of these dogs for myself Ė trust no one to tell you the truth especially Liberals. Today I was in Toronto and I was almost LMAO when I saw all the Staffies that Michael Bryant called inherently dangerous. What kind of moron included those dogs in any dog safety legislation, he may as well included teddy bears.

Also when itís time for the next dog I fully expect that in Ontario I will be able to CHOOSE any breed that I want. Iím betting money on it.

rottndakota
June 20th, 2005, 02:30 AM
In life we do not always get the chance to chose the ones we love.Often it happens without us even knowing it,that is until the day we wrap our arms around it and hold onto it for dear life.Without it,we suffer.

And so the story goes for all of us responsible dog owners that love maligned breeds.You sir,do not have the right to question why we chose the dogs we love.Nor does any narrow minded breed bigoted politician such as Michael Bryant nor his minions have that right.

It is absolutely unfortunate that not all dog people are at that point were they see the light in regard to breed specific legislation.

It is more than clear through serious scientific literature that the breed is irrelevant and that the relative size of the dogs compared to the victims, the number of dogs and the behavior of the owner are the only factors that matters.

Most, if not all, breeds have in their closet some pretty gruesome horror stories which does not speak well of the breed. Some of us are blessed in regard that our breed of choice, for many reasons, including rarity, disinterest from the media, better management by the breed clubs when their breeds were involved in accidents etc. , are not yet targeted by breed ban.

The tragedy which happened some years ago in California, involving Presa Canario, should have taught to ALL dog people, that the gods of fortune can change their mind.

What Mr. WALDO is doing, is undermining the very thing which would protect his breed, if tomorrow, one single dog of his current choice was involved in an accident. The list of breeds targeted is getting longer by the minute. Mr. WALDO should know better.

Unfortunately, we cant hold by the hand every single person heavily involved in the dog world. Some people apparently will have to learn through loss and tragedy what BSL is all about.

We are too few already which are fighting in the frontline, we cant afford the time to reason on a one by one basis with individuals who, for whatever reason, have rejected facts in favor of propaganda.

Getting publicly into a debate with such person would simply give them more attention than they deserved. Let them rave in peace. The soapbox does not have much attraction once there is nobody to listen. The best tactics is to keep flooding the public place with the best, most impartial information available.

It is the responsibility of breed clubs to do the policing when it comes to their individual members state in the public place.

This is why the DLCC has set a policy that we stand behind every single responsible dog owner and when we seek assistance in any form from a breed club, this is what they have to expect from us.

"We must all hang together, or, assuredly, we shall all hang separately." - Benjamin Franklin

In the mean time, Mr. Waldo is only one voice which, by a global effort at educating the public, will be marginalized. Lets keep plastering the medias with accurate information and in regard to one on one dialogs, focusing on people who are making the laws. This is the best and most positive use of our resources.

LeeAnn O'Reilly RN,PBMH
Pres.Dog Legislation Council of Canada
www.doglegislationcouncilcanada.org

"For the love of dog and man,we stand as one.We are the DLCC."
:ca:

babyrocky1
June 20th, 2005, 11:22 AM
Well, well, Waldo, "wheres Waldo?" I think were relatively sure were this Waldo is, basking in his ignorance no doubt . If youve been lurking on our site for so long, try reading hansard or go through some of the countless links on the site with scientific facts that prove you wrong, Im not going to waste my energy or emotion on you. Also if youve been reading the posts, this one is about Coping with the Ban, we check in here to find out strategies to keep our dogs happy and healthy while we prepare our legal challenge to the ban. Yep, Pit Bull owners are also covered under the CHARTER, sorry, I guess youre against that too. And just so you know, Im not a Hells Angel or a Malvern boy, and when I bought my dog through the newspaper, which I now know is the WRONG thing to do, I was told he was not a pit bull. I didn't want a pit bull then, because I knew there reputation, I didn't really believe the rep, but why take a chance? I too, was ignorant, but when I found out that my pup would at least be considered a pit bull by many, I imediatley began to educate myself with FACTS. I did what all responsible DOG owners would do, and I now love this breed, and would not CHOOSE another breed the next time! I would and will continue to try to get this, and any successive governments to enact good legislation that would protect the public from back yard breeders and dangerous and irresponsible dog owners. It would include mandatory spaying and nuetering for all dogs and would allow for life time bans of pet owner ship for people who abuse, neglect, or use their animals in the commission of crimes. It would include safety education for children and would be named for Courtney Trempe, who was a child killed by a dog, the dog was not a pit bull, in Ontario. A coroners inquest calling for some of these measures and many others was virtually ignored.
So what is it your doing to make Ontario safer Waldo? oh yeah your here bothering us! Bye bye Waldo!
Thanks for the great posts, Faceless, Two Dogs, and Rottndakota

bluntman
June 20th, 2005, 12:57 PM
Please come back Waldo!! I need a good Laugh every now and then at work. I had no idea I owned the most dangerous dog in the world, My wife seems to think we have the worlds most freindly dogs, wait till I tell her the bad news, Zena has be fakeing the hole time, and she is a really bad dog at heart.

Copper'sMom
June 20th, 2005, 01:24 PM
I feel sorry for all you Pit Bull owners. It looks most, if not all of you are responsible dog owners.

I feel sorry for YOU for the lack of education regarding Pit Bulls and the ignorance you have shown with your comments. And yes, we are RESPONSIBLE dog owners.

I don't have to do it with my dogs because when I picked them I used good judgement in choosing there breed. If you people had done this, you would not be faced with the problems you now have.

I knew exactly what kind of BS I would have to endure when I decided to own a Pit Bull. I didn't want people to judge me by my dog and most people don't! The people who do, are complete strangers and they are the uneducated and misinformed people. Hell, most people don't even know my dog is a Pit Bull! Do you have any idea how many strangers walk up to my dog to pet him, and don't even realise that he is a Pit Bull?

When you love something so much, you will do whatever it takes to defend and conquer any battles that may arise along the way.

Almost if not all breeds have all the qualities you people claim to love about your pit bulls with-out inbred desire to fight, so why did you choose a Pit? Unless you use it for pulling contests, I will assume (and probably correctly) that you chose it for it's rep.

You assume we chose to own Pit Bull's for their reputation?? What rep is that you refer to? For their loving personalities or for the BAD owners who abuse them and use them for fighting?
If we didn't care about our dogs so much, why would we bother trying to cope with any of this?

Responsible pit bull owners are not the majority! There are far too many of these dogs on the wrong hands.

You don't think we don't know this? There are also many other breeds in the wrong hands of people as well. Once the Pit Bull has been diminished, what breed do you think will be next? This is why BSL won't work! Why target the type of dog(innocent) and not the people who own them?? Not everyone is fit to own a dog or any other type of animal for that matter!

Believe it or not we will all be a lot safer and happier.

What about our happiness?? Why should we as RESPONSIBLE dog owners be punished for IRRESPONSIBLE owners? Maybe we should ban every breed who has ever bitten. Likely, there won't be a dog left in the world.


Stop fighting this ban!
It's comments like this, that make us fight harder and gives us more determination to do so. Thanks! :)

Just FYI, Pit Bulls were NEVER bred to be HUMAN AGGRESSIVE!! This is a learned behaviour from the dog's master. Do you think a dog wakes up one morning and decides today it will go out and attack someone? Is it not the owner's responsibility to make sure his/her dog is secured on their property? How can you blame the breed? It's the owner who is at fault. The owner is responsible for their dog and their dog's actions.

bluntman
June 20th, 2005, 02:01 PM
I see you own a collie and a boxer Waldo, both breeds are wonderfull when properly raised like most other dogs. But how much research did you do? Are you aware that in the two years before Kichener-Waterloo baned pit bulls, that Collies where responsible for Twice as many bites as pit bulls? And that a boxer-lab mix is fighting to stay alive in Kichener becuse of BSL? If you really belive banning is the answer to dog bite's, you should becarefull, becuse your Collie by make the list some time soon, If BSL is not defeated.
http://www.doglegislationcouncilcanada.org/KWBOH.html

Copper'sMom
June 20th, 2005, 02:28 PM
Ya beat me, bluntman! I had technical difficulties :mad:

Waldo, you had better read this link:

http://www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.ca/english/about/pubs/dola-pubsfty/dola-pubsfty.asp#TOC_10

You might want to pay particular attention to FAQ's section. Question #2.
Here it is for you now:

2. Is my dog a pit bull?

Under the amendments to DOLA, pit bull is defined as:

A pit bull terrier
A Staffordshire bull terrier
An American Staffordshire terrier
An American pit bull terrier
A dog that has an appearance and physical characteristics substantially similar to any of those dogs.

Here's your warning sign Waldo!
A dog that has an appearance and physical characteristics substantially similar to any of those dogs.
As bluntman said, right now a boxer-lab cross is fighting for it's life because it looks like a Pit bull. Your boxer may be next!!

We aren't only fighting for Pit Bull's, we are fighting for ALL BREEDS!

bluntman
June 20th, 2005, 03:01 PM
That's why I get a good Laugh, when I read post's like Waldo's. He really thinks BSL, and the ban do not affect him, becuse he was so carefull in picking his dog's. The reality is this Waldo, We are not picking on you, or your dogs, But like it or not, BSL affects ALL dog owners. If you truely want to know the truth, and the myth's we are here to help, But If you are convinced that everything you read in the paper is the all mighty truth, than there is not much we can do for you. All dog breeds can bite, thats a fact, so lets get over the "we will all be safer, with no pit bull's" thats a myth, and a lie that Bryant stands by, and get on with reduceing dog bite's, by education, and enforcment of current law's. Calgary has the lowest dog bite stats in Canada Waldo, and they do not ban pit bulls.

Luvmypit
June 20th, 2005, 04:04 PM
Don't let Waldo get to you. Its probably a troll anyways.

Who posts in the middle of a pit site when you are against the breed? Trolls.


I feel sorry for Waldo. Sorry misinformed coming to a website where he would get kicked in the arse with facts.

Schwinn
June 20th, 2005, 11:12 PM
How many children have to have there faces ripped apart or killed?

We'll let you know as soon as one is killed. Until then, maybe you should actually read statistics, or go to the Hansard and read what the experts say. You're terrified because you're misinformed. Oh, and as for wanting the dog because of the rep...I know hundreds of owners who are cops, teachers, lawyers, doctors, bank managers, etc. who disagree. And I don't think Don Cherry needs the rep either. We fight the ban because we've studied the statistics. If responsible owners are not the majority, then why is it with thousands upon thousands of pitbulls, are there not more problems. I don't have a problem with someone debating the issue, or disagreeing with my stance. I do, however, have a problem with someone saying stupid things because they either don't know, or don't care. I think I speak for the majority of us when I say we've seen the stats (not counted headlines) and the studies from dog experts (the average pit bull owner is more educated than any other owner because of the reputation. Some owners were against the breed until they read the facts, and THEN became a bully owner). That's our excuse for our opinions. What's yours?

waldo
June 20th, 2005, 11:51 PM
Well it seems I have ruffled a few feathers! First, for the record my opion is not a result of the media. I have been on the recieving end of one of your gentle Pit Bulls. That is what got me interested in them. The more research I did the more it became all to clear to me that this is not a dog for the general public. For the past couple of years it has been almost imposible to take one of our pets for a walk without running into a pit bull. Our small town of 6000 seems to be full of them. Most of the time they are pulling some teenager down the sidewalk. Almost always the owner is under 25. There is one man in town who is over 30 and has had his pit muzzled for years now. He would be the only responsible owner I have seen and not because of the muzzle. Most of these Kids can't afford food for themselves let alone their dogs. What about vet bills ??? Hard to get your dog fixed when their blowing their money on pot!! When I see a 80 pound 13 yr old girl being dragged down the side walk by a 90 pound Pit Bull all kinds of horrible things come to mind. I see it a lot. These are the people that are the real problem. The ones who get a pit just to say they have one. These are the majority of pit bull owners. This is the part of the problem you don't want to see. Not every person can handle an Enzo Ferrari. The same can be said for a pit bull. In the wrong hands???? Well we all know what can happen. You may have noticed that I don't use any stats, (unlike you people) because there are no accurate dog bit or dog attack stats in Canada. My opion is based on common sense. Like why in the world would you want a dog that can be controled but will always have the inbred desire or urge to attack or fight an other dog. In the wrong hands we have all seen what happens in a Pit Bull attack. How many times have you heard about a Pit Bull bite?? Not often I'll Bet. They don't just bite, they hang on and shake the hell out of what ever they have latched onto and don't stop! All those little children that have been on the news with ripped up faces have been media plants to start a crusade against the Pit Bull??? Yes I know other dogs do it too. I know in the right hands these dogs can be controlled. The problem is the wrong hands out number right ones. I also know breed banning could turn into a can of worms. As long as I never have to deal with another Pit Bull attack I don't care. I have been around dogs all my life and have never seen anything like these dogs when they attack. Nothing stops them.!!!! There are hundreds of breeds out there that can give you every thing your Pit Bull can with out the risks. If you can argue with this last statement, well???? These Dogs scare people in a way that dogs never have before, that is no stretch!!! I should be able to walk the streets without fear. I fear these dogs more then I loath them and it is not due to ignorance, I have done my research despite what you all will say and think. As for Trolling, I do that with a rod and a boat, not my mouth. Lastly if you people will elect the government for this country based on a dangerous dog law, I guess that in it self shows how narrow minded you are!!

Schwinn
June 21st, 2005, 12:14 AM
Apparently you haven't done your research, because you keep talking about all these kids who had thier faces ripped off, and you keep talking about the majority of pitbull owners who spend thier money on pot. When was the last time a child was mauled by a pitbull in Ontario? In Canada? As for wanting a pitbull when you can have any other dog, pitbulls are known to be one of the most loyal dogs, and also one of the most gentle with children. Of course, they may be just trying to lure the child into a false sense of security so they can "rip thier face off". I would suspect that the fact you were attacked by one probably set you off on an agenda to prove how vicious and evil the dogs are. Since you're into painting people with the same brush, I'd suggest that that is exactly what happened, since everyone who fights the breed has an agenda, and tends to ignore expert opinions. So, why is it that there are almost no experts (kennel clubs, vets, dog trainers, behaviouralists) who support the ban? Of course, it's obvious. You're smarter than all of them. You and all the other politicians and misinformed who spout the same crap. And as for your statement about being narrow-minded because we'll chose to elect a government to run this country based on BSL, well, that's just a special kind of stupid on several levels. I won't get into all of them, but the two most glaringly obvious would be 1) pay attention the next time you type in the website's name. No, not the www. Look ahead. Too far, not the .ca. That's it, right there, where you typed pets. I guess we should be debating thier socio-economic policies and thier stance on health-care in this forum? 2)Unless something has changed while I've been at the hospital the last couple of days, McGinty is only running the province, and Ontario is not the country.

You know, I'd love to have a battle of wits, but I really hate fighting an unarmed person.

Spurby
June 21st, 2005, 01:01 AM
Hello Waldo,

Are you here to learn more about the breed or engage in some fair debate on this breed? Or just to bash?

Honestly, i can emphasize with what you have seen out there with regards to this breed. Who here can deny seeing the teenager getting pulled down the street with a huge pit bull on-lead only to intiminate? Who here can deny this breed IS being bred and used for illegal purposes? Who here can deny this breed is so over-bred they are over flowing in the shelters? Who here can deny this breed is so over bred by the yahoo's of the world with lack of care with regards to the temperament and health of this breed?

That is the truth out there. Lots of bad breeders/owners, AND dogs with incorrect temperament for this breed. This breed is being destroyed by the BYB and irresponsible owners, plain and simple. The media is only partialy to blame.

Waldo, the pit bulls you have described are all owned by irresponsible owners no?
Most of the time they are pulling some teenager down the sidewalk. Almost always the owner is under 25.
When I see a 80 pound 13 yr old girl being dragged down the side walk by a 90 pound Pit Bull all kinds of horrible things come to mind
Most of these Kids can't afford food for themselves let alone their dogs


Why are you blaming the breed? Why are the parents allowing their kids to walk a large breed dog alone? Show me one attack where the owners of a "pit bull" were responsible owners.

Yes I know other dogs do it too. I know in the right hands these dogs can be controlled. The problem is the wrong hands out number right ones

Please read again what you admited Waldo. This breed can be owned and loved by responsible people. Thats the truth. There are over 28,000 pit bulls in Ontario, that is a huge number isn't it? You'd think if they were so dangerous and with these numbers there would be more attacks/bites?, you don't like stats, but they do help, and with these numbers, the attacks/bites for this breed are extremely LOW compared to their huge numbers, that is very telling don't you think?.

And lastly, why are you ignoring the fact other breeds attack/bite? The fact is, the "pit bull" is only responisble for ONE death in Canada..actually an Amstaff, the rest were various other breeds. Courtney Trempes mother, who's daughter died by a Bullmastiff attack, was against this ban, and rightly so. Her daughter and the many others attacked, mauled and killed by other breeds and mixes know that breed bans do not prevent these tragedies from happening. I personally think it is a slap in the face to these people, who were hurt by these irresponsible dog owners, and their calls for tougher dog owner legislation are ignored. What are your thoughts on this Waldo?

twodogsandacat
June 21st, 2005, 06:40 AM
The day after the ban passed the Toronto Sun had a front page shot of a canary. The point was this is what's coming.

Inside the story started with"
It was originally bred for dog fighting. The look of power flows from rippling muscles and deep chest up to its massive head and jaw. It may look like a pit bull, but the canary dog, or perro de presa canario, is twice as big and weighs up to 48 kilograms.

Until the law addresses the real issues you still aren't safe Waldo. You will start to see more Canary Dogs, Rottweilers, Dobermans and Mastiffs.

You can take all the Hondas away from kids who street race and they will replace them with Toyotas, Chevys and Chryslers. You need to address the act not the tool.

Check back in six months and let us know what kinds of dogs the punks are walking now.

bluntman
June 21st, 2005, 11:38 AM
Well it seems I have ruffled a few feathers!

Yes, if this was you intention, at least you got one thing right.

For the past couple of years it has been almost imposible to take one of our pets for a walk without running into a pit bull. Our small town of 6000 seems to be full of them

Yes, my city is full of pit bulls too, and I try to meet as many of them as I can. But with so many pit bulls out there, why are we not over run with daily pit bull attacks if they are all so bad?( our city keeps stats as well, and pit bulls are not a problem here)

This is the part of the problem you don't want to see. Not
every person can handle an Enzo Ferrari. The same can be said for a pit bull. In the wrong hands???? Well we all know what can happen.

Yes, and this is the part you don't want to see, and where BSL falls apart, some people should not own dogs period, take away the pit bull, and they can go and get another dog they can't handle untill all dogs are banned. Why not start at the sorce of the problem, BAD OWNERS?

You may have noticed that I don't use any stats, (unlike you people) I fear these dogs more then I loath them and it is not due to ignorance

True, If you are fueled by hate, and the stats don't work in your favor, you can't very well use them. can you?

There are hundreds of breeds out there that can give you every thing your Pit Bull can with out the risks. If you can argue with this last statement, well????

Well!!!. Really like what, A poodle, a bull Masstiff, a Rottie, a Shepard, presa canario? Your telling me I need to choose a dog that suites YOUR needs, not mine, then what do I do when YOU decide to Loath a different breed, do I switch again to keep YOU happy. No thanks Waldo, I will decide what type of dog to own, not people like YOU.

You are way out of your league here Waldo, a lot of us live with these dogs day in and day out, you may think you know something we don't, but from what you have said, It's obvious you don't know much about dogs at all. I choose to own a pit bull, becuse my Daughter was 10 at the time, and the best dog's I had every seen with children were pit bull/staffie dogs. It was the best decition I ever made, she has been an absloute angel,full of love and affection. Both my dogs absolutly worrship my daughter who is 18 now, and I will not hesatate to get another pit bull, despite the fact you loath a creature you have never met.
The main point you do not understand Waldo is a dog is only as good as it's owner, no matter what breed it is. A guy I know has a lasa apsu mix, it is so vicious, that the postman will not deliver mail if the dog is outside, perhaps we can ban them too, and then the next dog he gets, may be big enough to kill a mailman, not just bite him. It's too bad you don't see the owner's are the problem not the dogs, but then again, I really don't care any more, if you get it or not.
Good-bye Waldo.

Copper'sMom
June 21st, 2005, 12:26 PM
We, the dog owners on this board are RESPONSIBLE owners. If you want to gripe about irresponsible owners and the breeds they own, then go tell them to their face. You don't have to lecture us on things we already know. We know there are many young teenage kids who own Pit Bulls. But when you have BYB, irresponsible breeders breeding their dogs to make a few bucks, they don't care who they are selling the pups to. These people are the root of the problem!

As for myself, I'm 28 years old, 5 ft tall and weigh about 90lbs and have the determination of a Mack Truck. My boy weighs 80lbs. The difference between myself and some 18 year old kid is MATURITY and RESPONSIBILITY. My dog knows, I'm in command. And don't think he hasn't tested my strength! If he really wanted that squirrel bad, one day, he would have succeeded. He actually broke the ring on his collar, but didn't know it. I called him to my side and we simply walked away. He had no idea he could have chased that squirrel. Just remember, Waldo, this was a SQUIRREL not a human being.

I don't allow my dog to walk me. I walk him! These young kids, most if not all of them don't know how to train a dog - any dog! I've seen Jack Russels pulling their owner along! As said before, a dog is only as good as it's owner.
If I don't think that I can't control my dog in certain situations, I avoid them altogether. Why? Because I'm a RESPONSIBLE PIT BULL OWNER!!

babyrocky1
June 21st, 2005, 02:22 PM
h. Lastly if you people will elect the government for this country based on a dangerous dog law, I guess that in it self shows how narrow minded you are!![/QUOTE]
Ive decidied not to futher engage in a conversation with you regarding "pit bulls" However this last statement is political and it is a huge assumption on your part. I would never elect a government based on one issue and only my own interests considered in that decision. However, and I know you disagree, but I believe that the liberals particularly Michael Bryant and Dalton Mcguinty, INTENTIONALLY deceived the public with this bill. They were motivated solely for political gain and for this reason cannont be trusted to act in the best interests of the public period. They have shown themselves to be ruthless liars. That is why this one issue determines who many of us will vote for. We are not just responsible dog owners, but also politically and socially active, although we are not all of the same political stripe, I think we all agree on this.
Okay just one more point on the dog thing, if all dogs had to be spayed and nuetered, we would eliminate backyard breeders which is where these kids your so worried about got there dogs and that would solve that problem right there, also nuetering male dogs goes a long way to curb any aggressive tendncies- no ban needed. Once again, let me stress, we are not just against a pit bull ban! We are FOR intelligent laws. There are at least three separate, existing, "dangerous dog" pieces of Legislation that are not breed specific and would address all of your "legitimate concerns" If its true that you have had real problems with a pit bull then Im sorry for your difficultie, but we all have our predudices with breeds that we have had bad experiences with, you still need to sort out fact from fiction if your going to intentionally cause debate on a site like this.

lezzpezz
June 21st, 2005, 03:14 PM
[QUOTE=Schwinn]: that's just a special kind of stupid on several levels.

I'm trying to read the rest of the posts, but it is hard to do with all of the tears falling from my eyes!! Hahahaha Schwinn..you are too much....way to shut 'im down! :D

Luvmypit
June 21st, 2005, 04:01 PM
What kills me is that you would say how could you want a dog that would kill another dog. Sorry i forgot to quote.....


Sorry to let you know honey but dog agression is very common in dogs in many a breed. So if that is your argument then you would have a lot of banning to do. And dog agression does not mean human agression.

I am so sorry for your bad experience but I nor my dog are going to be punished because you have some 13 year olds running around with pit bulls.

Sorry but I am not their mother nor their breeder.

waldo
June 21st, 2005, 11:40 PM
Wow! Just like a swarm of bees lol. For people who like to talk about others making assumptions, you people on that side of fence sure have made a lot about me. Keep guessing. I'm going to make this my last post. There is no piont in me starting an other debate on this subject. It's a "done deal". Pit Bulls in Ontario will soon be a thing of the past! Plus it is little like rubbing salt in the wound. I am no stranger to the pit bull forums and can hold my own in any argument. Not that it's tough against your crowd. The law and the majority of people want your gentle dog gone. Never stops amazing me how often I here you people sprout off facts about dog bites (there are none in Canada) wonder were you find them? Every time there is an attack the first thing I hear from your crowd is are they sure it's a pit bull?, there goes the media again, Or my personal fav. there was a collie did the same thing a year ago. I know dogs, despite what you think, and if you knew as much about them as you think, you would not have chosen the pit bull. I am so sick of hearing how loyal they are or how eager to please they are, so what! If you knew any thing about dogs you would know the same can be said for all breeds ( Chow can be an iffy one ). How many mixed breed dogs have given their lives to defend their owners? Check into that. Why do you want to own the king of the dog fight ring? Because it's so loyal? "ya right" It's a no brainer why people want this breed. Thats why it has been banned!!!! Like I said before a poor choice. Next time some small child has been mauled or some old lady has had her poodle turned into a bunch of bloody clumps of fur by your beloved breed, go to the hospital and explain to that child how wonderfull and loving the Pit Bull is! Go tell that old lady why the ban is wrong and every one should be able to own a Pit Bull. You people make me sick! The minute the truth is in front of you, you ignore it, call it a lie, twist it around so you don't have to face the truth. You all know how big this problem has become! You don't care about general public. You just have to have a pit bull. You remind me very much of the folks south of the border who think every house should have couple of automatic weapons and every one should be able to cary a hand gun. Strange how their argument and your's sound alike!!! You don't like the things I say because they come to close to the reallity of the situation and don't blen in with your version of the facts, too bad!!

Faceless
June 22nd, 2005, 01:12 AM
Thanks for revealing your true colours, troll.

Try to come here pretending to be a reasonable person, but really sporting a hidden agenda based on your own personal, biased experiences with a couple of dogs.

Newsflash. Boxers have killed people. Boxers have been used for dog-fighting. Why did you choose such a dangerous breed?

Hypocrite. Don't let the door hit you on your way out.

twodogsandacat
June 22nd, 2005, 06:48 AM
I agree he's a troll.

Dukieboy
June 22nd, 2005, 08:29 AM
Wow!! I have been away for a couple of days. Good riddance to bad rubbish eh? What hole did he crawl out of?

bluntman
June 22nd, 2005, 09:32 AM
Wow!! I have been away for a couple of days. Good riddance to bad rubbish eh? What hole did he crawl out of?

Not to sure but it must have been a small one, he just keep's spouting the same old B.S, over and over, nothing new or original, Just like Bryant. The funny thing is he really believes there will be no more pit's becuse of the ban, this guy is really "out there". I better not tell him I will have another pitty by the end of the summer, along with hundreds of other people.

There was a nice artical in the sun last week saying the toronto humane society is haveing no trouble finding homes for there pit bulls. To bad, Waldo pits will be here for a loooong time to come.

Luvmypit
June 22nd, 2005, 10:15 AM
For people who like to talk about others making assumptions, you people on that side of fence sure have made a lot about me.

You remind me very much of the folks south of the border who think every house should have couple of automatic weapons and every one should be able to cary a hand gun. Strange how their argument and your's sound alike!!!
Whos making the assumptions hipocrite?

If you knew any thing about dogs you would know the same can be said for all breeds ( Chow can be an iffy one ).
Apparently your the one who doesn't know that. Your right the same can be said for alll breeds. All breeds can attack, all can bite, all can run , all can play. I will assume you agree with us then.

You know so much about dogs and you say we throw stats around so what is your proof? Please enlighten me. Please don't use the newspaper either. Really credible info. I know we can show you some credible info. Can you?


You come on here blabbing about all these things and your doing exactly what your accusing us of doing.

TROLL ALERT TROLL ALERT.

If you want to have a real discussion then don't belittle us.

Do me favour go and tell all those people who have recieved therapy work from pit bulls that these dogs will eat them.
Go tell the people who have been saved by pit bull search and rescue.
Go tell all the kids in your neighbourhood that petey from the little rascalz is evil and shouldn't be alive
Go tell helen Kellar that her seeing eye dog really was a montrous animal.
Go tell a veteran that the dog who served right beside them in war should have been shot there.
go tell all the other people of dog bites and deaths that they should suck it up because they haven't been bit by the most dangeorus dog. Tell them there wounds are nothing.

i could go on by I don't have time for you.

babyrocky1
June 22nd, 2005, 11:23 AM
One of the great things about going on the protest walk on Sunday was that I met people who have been visiting our Pit Bull Co-op thread and would like to be involved, thanks to Waldo it was hijacked and now it will be more difficult for well -meaning new comers to check some of the links reference, and discussion leading up to our little group, also I would like to see the thread keep on topic, which is strategies on coping with the ban, health, exercise, socializaton, what kind of muzzles, peoples experiences etc. How to interput some of the laws etc. So my question to you guys, is how we should re-organize, should I start a Pit Bull Co-op 2, waldo free ofcourse, or is it possible to have the mods remove the whole Waldo discussion and put it somewhere else? Not that I think debating Waldo wasn't a good idea, it was very hard to resist, but now the thread is difficult to negotiate, especially for new-comers.

Faceless
June 22nd, 2005, 11:51 AM
I suggest you start a new thread, and maybe see if you can make it a sticky.

Schwinn
June 22nd, 2005, 12:29 PM
Anyone else find it ironic that Waldo states that what he/she is saying is a no-brainer? At least we all agree on one thing about him/her.

It really shows how little research Waldo has done, since he thinks only the idiots who stage dog fights fight pitbulls. Wait until he finds out that there are PLENTY of boxers being fought.

Very few people here have a problem debating thier choices. Also, very few people have little tolerance for some clueless idiot walking in the middle to make stupid statements. I don't know you, you're right. And I'm glad. But I will go out on a limb and say you are probably that idiot busy-body that every neighbourhood has who thinks they know everything, and are usually wrong. And the fact that they would say, "Actually, everyone who knows me knows that I am a smart person" is further proof of how dumb you are.

I really do hope you're a troll, because otherwise, you're just an ignorant jack ass. Man, you'd have to get better to suck.

lezzpezz
June 22nd, 2005, 01:30 PM
from another current thread, re: "now that my dog is a pitbull....." (even when it is not!!)

[QUOTE=JenSteele]For those who don't know the rest of the story about the alleged pitbull attack in Cambridge Ontario last week... Cambridge HS/SPCA made a public statement last night that:

1) The dog was not a pitbull it was a boxer mix
2) The dog was being abused - they've been tracking the dog because they saw the owner hit the dog when he picked it up 5 days after the HS/SPCA impounded the dog instead of coming to get it right away
3) The owner was drunk when the attack happened
4) The owner can't be charged because the police killed the dog

And that the Cambridge HS/SPCA have received a death threat for telling the truth.

Did you see the part about it being a BOXER MIX and NOT a pit bull??? Fascinating, wouldn't you agree?? Wait a minute....didn't I read in a post during this thread that YOU own a boxer and a collie?? Oh my goodness, should we ban boxers???? :eek:

And, how's about the part that the idiot owner had been abusing the poor dog?? Now there's a huge suprise, eh Waldo? Seems to me this just illustrates our point quite poignantly....It's clearly another case of a BAD OWNER and not a bad dog, and not even the breed that is facing the ban....YET!! Perhaps you would like to reconsider which breed YOU choose to own, in light of recent facts, yes, from the headlines......

Copper'sMom
June 22nd, 2005, 01:58 PM
Don't come crying to us, when some stranger sees you walking your boxer(that is if you walk your dogs) and you are accused of owning a Pit Bull or if someone reports your dog to the HS because they think your dog LOOKS like a Pit Bull and not a boxer. Don't be surprised if you get dirty LOOKS because your dog looks like a Pit Bull.

You are a waste of time, just as the ban is. We'll have to wait and see what the next "killing machine" comes around.

Oh, one question you might care to answer:

How will Bill 132 prevent dogs from escaping from their irresponsible owners yard and attacking? Muzzles are only required when your dog is LEASHED in public - not when they are in their yard!

Loki
June 22nd, 2005, 02:54 PM
So my question to you guys, is how we should re-organize, should I start a Pit Bull Co-op 2, waldo free ofcourse, or is it possible to have the mods remove the whole Waldo discussion and put it somewhere else? Not that I think debating Waldo wasn't a good idea, it was very hard to resist, but now the thread is difficult to negotiate, especially for new-comers.

I'm not sure. After re-reading the whole thread:

Waldo unintentionally did an incredible job of demonstrating exactly why this thread was created in the first place. One of the reasons you guys started the thread was, you were looking for a place to excercise your dogs, where you could be free from people that go out of their way to harass and instigate you. When you read it in the context of the entire thread, it gives a great illustration of the type of stuff innocent, responsible people are having to deal with.

I admit that I find it depressing, knowing that there are people out there that feel the need to look for sites, and join - simply to try to instigate.
Maybe I misread, but that's the impression I got from Waldo's posts.

Then again, alot of us have had to deal with "that guy" that hangs around the park waiting to see someone with a "pitbull" to harass( Guy at my park goes after everything from Jack Russells to Labs to Gsd, yelling at owners about their "pitbull").

It's kinda funny when you think about it, "pitbull Co-op" may have it's own on-line "that guy."

Personally, I'd leave the thread as-is, and just try to get back on-topic.
If Waldo wants to debate pitbulls, he should have the courtesy to start a new thread, or reply to one of the many other threads on that topic.

His arguments and comments certainly aren't helping his cause any, and they definitely aren't adding anything to this thread. If anything, his comments paint a very unflatering picture of breed ban supporters.

waldo
June 22nd, 2005, 10:12 PM
Well Loki, you'r right I do look for sites where I can debate the pit bull issue. It is a subject that I am afraid I feel very strongly about and I have to admit that I some times get a little carried away. I also have to admit that my words are chosen for affect more then meaning sometimes. All that said I have put a considerable amount of time into research on the subject.
About 12 yrs ago my family and I were visiting my father who owned a Scottish Terrier. My middle daughter who was just under 2 at the time was sitting on the floor with her bottle making little baby noises while she drank. For no reason the dog lept up and grabed her by the face. Good thing she was between my feet or it could have been much worse. This really troubled me because I could not figure out what triggered the attack. Not knowing much about the breed I started to find out what ever I could. It didn't take long for me to come up with a reason for the attack. He was a Ratter! It must have been the noise she was making the set him off. In looking into the Scottish Terrier I also looked into the Terrier group and found that almost all of them were bred to hunt and kill vermon! (yes there is a point to all this) The more I researched the terriers, the quicker I came to the conclusion that they are not the best household pet. The Kennel clubs all class them in a group alone. They are uniuqe in the dog world. Drop a rat in front of a Scottish Terrier and watch how quickly the sweet little thing turns into a killer! My fathers dog bit 2 more small children the same age in the face before he finally got rid of it. All this time I never took my kids to his house. His love for the dog clouded his judgement and he never told the people who took the dog what he was like. I took care of that!! Wounder where I'm going with all this? Well this where my dislike for terriers started. It would be almost 9 yrs after all this before I would finally come face to face with a pit bull. Some punk sicked his pit bull on my old crippled up boxer. I was walking the dog with all my children at the time. It was not pretty! My dog had no clue how to fight all she did was try to run and yelp for help. By the time I got the pit bull off her she was badly chewed up. Yes I had help or she would probably be dead. This is when my dislike for the Pit Bull started. I know it was not the dogs fault, he just happened to be owned by a stupid punk who knew how to bring out the worst of the breed. I have read every thing I have ever found on the pit since. Now this is why I choose to make an other post. You all think I am narrow minded and simply hate the Pit Bull. I will admit that I do hate these dogs, even though I realise it is not their fault. They are what man has made of them. I also realise that they are only as good as their owner, like all dogs. My problem is they are not like all dogs. I beleive they are are quite unique in the dog world. When I hear people on your side of the fence say things like you own a boxer they have killed people too, it really gets me worked up. If you know anything about dogs you know that almost all have done terrible things. If I had said I owned a lab one of you would have said the same thing. If I said I owned a pom one of you would have brought up the case of the one that killed a baby (in california I think). I see and hear this line all the time from your group. The reason you do it is simple! Not one of you will admit that the Pit Bull is different from all other dogs. You are always looking for a way to make it look just like all other dogs. The other thing you keep saying is how loyal and loving it is. You do this to try and make it look better then other dogs. All dogs raised and trained properly will be loyal and loving. Give me any dog a stick and a couple of weeks and I can turn it into a dangerous dog. What I can't do is give it what the Pit Bull got from breeding. All dogs were bred for a purpose. Yours was bred to fight and kill other dogs. Yes it's not the only one. But when the terrier was mixed with the bull dog the perfect combination was found. If you know dogs you know that the terrier wont stop. This is why when Pit Bulls attack an other pet or a human the results are so horrible. They don't just bite once. They grab on and shake until the victom is dead or they are some how pulled off. This is just one thing that makes them different. This is what got it into the headlines. It's rep is what has made it so popular with wrong group. 20 yrs ago pit bulls were rare now I can't walk down the street without seeing one. They are everywhere! I should not have to be looking over my shoulder all the time for a pit bull when walking my dogs. I should not have to cross the street or turn the other way when I see one. You all think that the bad ones are the minority. Well you are wrong on that! I know I picked this fight on this forum. You were not really debating the issue and I came looking for an argument. It is because I keep seeing the same old thing. Not one of you ever talks about an instence were your Pit Bull was a problem or tried to go after an other dog. I know must happen once in a while. Always talking about how your dogs are so well behaved as if all Pit Bulls are. How the ban is so unfair. The ban is here because the Pit Bull has become like a plague. The rest of us are always looking out for a pit bull. I am not afraid for my-self. I am afraid for my pets and my children when they are walking my dogs. I realise that not all of you are part of the bigger problem but by fighting the ban you are becoming part of it. Yes this ban could get out of hand and all I can do is hope it wont. If you had fallen in love with a different breed of dog you would feel the same way about it as you do about your Pit Bull. Try a Boxer, they are a gentle fun loving clown of a dog, things I here said about the pit bull all the time. All they want to do is play till about 3 minutes before they die. There are plenty of other breeds that aren't considered so dangerous. Yes I know you are fighting the ban because it is wrong not because you own a pit bull. I think that if you didn't own a pit bull you would probably feel the way most of us do. Beleive it or not this breed is one we can all live without. I have owned other breeds of dog and feel just as strongly about them as I do about Boxers. I don't keep German shepards anymore but I still think they are the king of dog. There is a breed out there to fill every nich, we can do without the king of dog fights. I hope this can help you understand why some of us fell the way we do or maybe you will you still want to beleive that I am just a narrow minded hate monger looking for a fight. What ever matters not to me. Look at your dogs for what they really are and what they are capable of in the wrong hands, because far to many of the wrong hands have one. They are Unique!!! Thats it, call me all the names you want, I'm gone.

Dukieboy
June 23rd, 2005, 07:49 AM
Ya promise? Please educate yourself. http://goodpooch.com/

Faceless
June 23rd, 2005, 08:19 AM
Is he really gone? He already said it, then came back to post again. No wonder he supports the Lie-berals ban, they have something in common.

Once a troll, always a troll.

Waldo likes to use anecdotal evidence based on jaded personal experience to prove his distorted, bigoted claims, not scientific evidence which disproves the ridiculous claim that Pit bull type dogs are a "breed apart."

No matter what he claims, he believes he knows better than the majority of animal experts, and nothing that can be said will change his mind. They had that mentality in Mississippi in the 60s too.

"People" like Waldo guarantee that we will fight this ban as long and as hard as it takes, until it is done away with. So I guess we should really say "Thank you Waldo, for strengthening our determination. And contributing to the fact that the Pit-bull will be around in Ontario long after McGuinty, Bryant, and even Waldo himself are long gone."

Dukieboy
June 23rd, 2005, 08:28 AM
Just like Bryant. How unfortunate. Another "Big Jim the Chief", gonna save the world from everything but himself.

bluntman
June 23rd, 2005, 10:53 AM
Waldo just like's to read his own bull, no one in there right mind would come to a site filled with people who love all breeds, and then try to spread hate about the one's he does'nt like, he's a just fool. I would allmost love to debate with him, but he's got nothing interesting to say that make's any sence about how safe bill 132 will make us, and how bad our wonderfull wiggle butts are. He is just a waste of time,
He can keep telling himself how he can "hold his own" in a pit bull forum, but thats just more bull.
Every time I get a hug and a kiss from a pit bull, I will remember Waldo, and what he is missing out on.
Good riddence Waldo!

P.S sorry your thread got highjacked babyrock.

babyrocky1
June 23rd, 2005, 11:23 AM
Itbull").

It's kinda funny when you think about it, "pitbull Co-op" may have it's own on-line "that guy."

Personally, I'd leave the thread as-is, and just try to get back on-topic.
If Waldo wants to debate pitbulls, he should have the courtesy to start a new thread, or reply to one of the many other threads on that topic.

His arguments and comments certainly aren't helping his cause any, and they definitely aren't adding anything to this thread. If anything, his comments paint a very unflatering picture of breed ban supporters.
Good point Loki, WALDO you keep telling us you are gone but you don't go, so let me explain this one more time, slowly, so you will understand. You are on a democratic forum, if you would like to cause debate FINE, but at least respect the rules of the forum, this post is not here to debate the ban, it was created to COPE with the ban _ the one that you so vigorously support, so as Loki has suggested, start your own thread, Im sure many people on the forum will be happy to engage you in debate just for fun, but Im really losing my patience here! GO AWAY WALDO!

Copper'sMom
June 23rd, 2005, 12:25 PM
I should not have to be looking over my shoulder all the time for a pit bull when walking my dogs. I should not have to cross the street or turn the other way when I see one.

At least you can walk your dogs! I live in a rural area where farmers and their neighbours allow their dogs to run free. I CAN'T take my dogs out for a nice walk for fear that their dogs will come out and attack my dogs! How will my dogs defend themselves when they will be wearing a muzzle?? Why should I have to turn around and run home?? How is this fair Waldo?? And don't give me the **** about choosing a different breed either, because this would still happen if I was walking a different dog! When people are IRRESPONSIBLE, this is when accidents happen! No dogs should be allowed to roam free unless they are well trained and under SUPERVISION by their owners.

The ban is here because the Pit Bull has become like a plague.

You're right Waldo. But what breed will become the next plague, and the one after that, and the one after that? We aren't only fighting for Pit Bulls, we are fighting for all dogs. This is a matter of RESPONSIBLE ownership! Banning certain breeds is a "quick fix" to the problem. It will not solve the problem indefinitely. Apparently, society feels that anyone and everyone should be able to own a dog or a cat or a horse! Unfortunately, this is not the case! If there were restrictions placed on who can own an animal, many people wouldn't bother with the hassle. This would mean - less abuse, cruelty and abandonment of these animals. People wouldn't be drowning that unwanted litter of kittens or puppies because their cat or dog got knocked up accidentally. Young kids, drug addicts, alcoholics and the list goes on wouldn't be allowed to own Pit Bulls or any other breed of dog or animal if restrictions were in place on pet ownership. There should be laws of who can own an animal, any animal. This would also help stop breeding as there would be a law for this too of course. No, the world will never be perfect, but it may help this situation by bringing it under control better than what it is right now.

Not one of you ever talks about an instence were your Pit Bull was a problem or tried to go after an other dog. I know must happen once in a while.
Here's my experiences:
1)My fiance's brother's dog(husky) kept trying to "ride, hump, mate etc" my dog. They are both males(husky intact, 7 years old). After trying to do this repeatedly, my dog had had enough. Copper turned his neck around growled and grabbed the husky quickly and let go again. No shaking, no good grip on his neck, nothing but a warning. That was it. The dogs were separated and that was the end. He wasn't lunging and trying to go after the other dog after they were separated. He just ignored him.
2)My fiance's friend's dog tried to hump Copper too. This dog was about one year old. Same thing happened. As soon as Copper growled I pulled him away.
3)When my fiance and I first met, we introduced our dogs. He warned me that his dog doesn't like other dogs in his yard. Slowly we introduced them, they were fine. Not thinking(on my part), I gave them a toy to play with. My fiance's dog became possesive of the toy(even though it wasn't his toy) and attacked my dog. We split them up and Copper had no idea that the other dog was being aggressive towards him. They now have been buddies for three and a half years.
Do you know what these 3 stories have in common? I, being a responsible owner was right there to stop anything from happening. I remove my dog from these situations promptly. If I don't feel comfortable, I walk away from the potential problem or take precautious measures to avoid it.

RESPONSIBLE owners avoid these kinds of situations. Every dog reacts differently to seeing another dog. It usually depends on what turf the dog is on and how one dog reacts to the other.

I think that if you didn't own a pit bull you would probably feel the way most of us do.
Not true, there are other people involved in BSL who don't own Pit Bulls and some probably don't even know one personally. But they do know how to solve the problem and BSL isn't it!

Pit Bull's don't always start the fight, Waldo. It's kind of like the situation you are in right now with all of us. WE DIDN'T START THE FIGHT!! We didn't start it, but we will finish it!

Dukieboy
June 23rd, 2005, 01:11 PM
Quote "20 yrs ago pit bulls were rare now I can't walk down the street without seeing one. They are everywhere! I should not have to be looking over my shoulder all the time for a pit bull when walking my dogs. I should not have to cross the street or turn the other way when I see one. You all think that the bad ones are the minority. Well you are wrong on that!"


Hey Waldo,

How would you like to get up at 5am every morning to walk your dog so that you don't run into some crazy pitbull hater like yerself? HUH????? I am just so gratefull to those early risers out there, the homeless, the Mad Vac garbage guy and a few others who don't have hate in thier hearts and say goodmorning to Duke and sometimes even give him a treat. Realizing he is not something to be feared. No, at five in the morning most of you ignorant hate mongering folks are still asleep and I can safely walk my wonderful dog.

lezzpezz
June 23rd, 2005, 01:20 PM
To quote Copper'sMom: "there are other people involved in BSL who don't own Pit Bulls and some probably don't even know one personally. But they do know how to solve the problem and BSL isn't it!"

I am one of them...don't own a Pit Bull but do realize the insanity of BSL and how wrong it is to enact such crap....only trouble looms ahead, not just for PB's and their owners but for the likes of Waldo, even though he/she is too clouded to notice.....just wait for it.....

Schwinn
June 23rd, 2005, 07:42 PM
First of all, Waldo, you're a jackass. You came in and attacked everyone, saying we all have pitbull owners because we need to feel tough, and we all are pothead's. Well, I know there are a few cops, a couple of bank managers, and someone who is in the legal profession who own pits in this forum.

Secondly, if you had done as much research as you say you have, you would have found out that the kennel clubs say this about the pitbull-

"The American Pit Bull Terrier makes an excellent family companions and have always been noted for their love of children."

You'd also have come across this, again from the kennel clubs-

" The APBT is not the best choice for a guard dog since they are extremely friendly, even with strangers. Aggressive behavior toward humans is uncharacteristic of the breed and highly undesirable."

So, to say that you did plenty of research and still holds your opinion shows you are either a liar, stupid, or selective in your research looking only for those which fit your pre-determined conclusion.

Does anyone else find Waldo's modis-operandi familiar? Let's see, makes up facts, spouts stats which only fit thier pre-determined conclusion, makes promises then breaks them (keeps promising to leave then comes back), avoids direct confrontation with individuals (a la CityTV)? MY GOD, THE LIBERALS HAVE INFILTRATED THE BOARD!!

You wrecked your credibility when you came in here and acted like a jerk. And I believe you can hold your own. I can't imagine anyone elses wanting to hold yours.

Mom_Of_Two_Dogs
June 24th, 2005, 01:04 PM
EVERY dog owner has to be concerned about Bill 132, Waldo, not just those who have pit bulls. For the simple act of scaring a child, your dog (regardless of breed) could be declared menacing and taken away to be killed before you say goodbye to it. Even worse, it could be sent to a lab for research. I hate how this part of Bill 132 is so often ignored.

Luvmypit
June 24th, 2005, 02:03 PM
How can someone say its not your fault or the dogs yet the only one getting punished is the dog? So you support a bill that gives the dog all the credit yet you don't think it should be that way. Half of your post proved our point.

Your argument is that they do more damage but yet you don't want to hear anything about other dog attacks that have caused fatalities. How you can you possibly have an informed opinion? If you don't want to hear anything else. That is the part that has me falling over laughing. Because you say we don't want to hear this and I don't want to hear that. So basically you just came here to lamblast (is that a word?) us and expect that we don't give a rebuttal? Your the one who obviously doesn't listen.

And if your seeing pit bulls all over the place then how come there aren't more attacks? Trust me if there is one the newspaper will find it.

What do you want from us Waldo to stop. did you really think you post a couple personal experiences , no fact. Just say you did the research and expect us to go ok your right. Forge on Bill 132. LOL.

Basically you came here with a your all wrong attitude and don't even try to give me real factual information or I will just throw it out anyways. Surely that can't help your cause. Showing very clearly that you havent really done the research because you will only consider evidence that proves your point. How can you be unbiased then?

I also know MANY MANY dog owners of other breeds that feel the same way about Bill 132 as we do. They certainly were able to make an informed opinion. So what is their motive?
If you really wanted to have a real discussion you could have. But you lost alllllll credibility with your stereotypes of owners and the dogs we keep.

Go back to the bridge you came from TROLL.

babyrocky1
June 24th, 2005, 05:01 PM
[QUOTE=bluntman]
There was a nice artical in the sun last week saying the toronto humane society is haveing no trouble finding homes for there pit bulls. QUOTE] Now theres good news for a change Im really relieved to here that! I was under the impression that it had been difficult, but I honestly think that for the most part our message is slowly getting out there and going on that walk on Sunday and watching people joyfully greeting the staffy bulls was so wonderful! There were a few people not too happy to see us, but an overwelming majority were positive.

babyrocky1
June 30th, 2005, 09:31 PM
Well fellow Pit Bull Co-operators, and FRIENDS of PB Cooperators here is my attempt to revive this thread in a more positive manner, it looks like Waldo is gone so Im going to try and get us back on track. I know its the start of the long weekend and all and most of you are probably lucky enough to be away but I think that the last we were chatting about dates most everyone was busy til around now. I am still busy but I do have a much more flexible schedule now. The only thing I really can never do is mornings! I work wednesday through Friday eve but if theres no other time I will take an evening off. I am desperate to get this started again, especially after the events of this week. Im totally open to do a meeting or a just a play date. I have found out that there are a group of people already researching the idea of land and investigating insurance, they have been reading our thread. This is a very good thing! I dont want to post too much about that now as I dont feel as comfortable about putting info here after the whole Waldo thing. I hope your all having a great long weekend, and Im looking forward to you all posting here soon! :thumbs up

Dukieboy
July 4th, 2005, 08:20 AM
Hope everyone had a great long weekend. Babyrocky keep us posted about that other group.

babyrocky1
July 5th, 2005, 11:17 AM
My hope is that the "other group" will be dropping in here. Thats how we left it when we spoke. The are still in the idea stage as well, they have some resources that we dont have, they are looking for more people. I think that if this is to expand beyond casual relationships, play dates, and finding places that we will not be kicked out of and into something more formal eventually, we should start to brain storm about how something like this might work. For-instance if we got the land and worked out the ins. issues like,would it be possible to have people just sign wavers about the dogs, . What kind of structure should we have. I think that we could all be founding members and people joining after the initial group is formed should have to be screened by existing members to make sure we are exclusively for Responsible owners! I live in a co-op for the arts, when someone applies for membership, they are interviewed by two members, one a rep from wahatever art discipline they are and the other any ole member, point is they are asked a series, long series, of questions, to determine, one is they are truly an artist rather than a hobbiest, but more importanatly if they are the kind of person that would contribute positively to the community. I wonder if people who have these "private dog parks" have this kind of process. What do you all think?

babyrocky1
July 21st, 2005, 07:53 PM
Hi Pitbull Co--operators :) Just a fsst bump up cause Im at work....I think we really need to get things going soon!!! my schedule is much more flexiible now but Rocky is not that accomodating..he hates this heat...anyway the date is fast approaching and except for Rocky and Kayla our pups have not been dating, hopefully the weather will give us a bit of a break soon and we can make some playdates BEFORE the BAN! We also need to start to develop some plans. I kno alot of people will be away but lets at least start to make some play dates! I dont know whats going on withthe other group that was supposed to visit but I do know they have alot of other things ontheir mind with the ban being so close, if we are organized first we can approach them. Is everyone still interested? I have more ideas about this tooo but theyre paging me...darn people cant they see Im busyLOL